The Environment Thread :-)
59 watchers
Jun 2024
7:55pm, 24 Jun 2024
22,500 posts
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rf_fozzy
The key point being that until we hit RE regularly supplying >~80% of electricity, we don't really need storage
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Jun 2024
8:03pm, 24 Jun 2024
22,501 posts
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rf_fozzy
Depending on what you count as RE (biomass?), we are averaging about 40% total RE, and about 55% if include nuclear as low carbon electricity. mygridgb.co.uk Storage becomes critical when that RE goes from 40->70, so we could double our RE (take out biomass) *generation* (not capacity) before it starts to become critical. But to help smooth out supply to meet demand, what we can also do is overbuild and geographically spread (bearing in mind many of the best wind sites have been used) to ensure generation of some note all the time. Obviously storage can be ramping up in the meantime too. |
Jun 2024
8:10pm, 24 Jun 2024
17,338 posts
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jda
We already have oversupply of RE at some times. Building more will increase that wastage. It’s only wastage if you refuse to store it, of course. But that’s the argument you are trying to make. If batteries are used regularly then they aren’t a waste of resources. I don’t know what the break-even point is for how much cycling makes them worthwhile but clearly people are finding them useful right now in the real world. |
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Jun 2024
8:14pm, 24 Jun 2024
22,502 posts
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rf_fozzy
That curtailment is irrelevant at the moment, because we are still burning FF. Until CCGT is used as demand management (or getting close to it), then it's not important. What needs to change is the policy pricing - I think at the moment, it's based on gas? If that changes instead of curtailing Wind/Solar, you curtail gas. That's the issue currently, not that we aren't storing all the energy from RE (and also getting the energy infrastructure up to spec). |
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Jun 2024
8:18pm, 24 Jun 2024
22,503 posts
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rf_fozzy
I can see your argument - on a individual or local scale - and yes, there you are right (to some extent) - local storage does make sense - I have a battery and it means I basically have zero electricity useage through the summer. But, local storage isn't going to solve the problem of intermittency - here we need grid storage - be that batteries, PSH or some other whacky scheme (and there have been a few proposed). And we're not at the point where grid storage is critical. Definitely need to be thinking about it and of course, it should be ramping up (S curves again), but it's not the most important thing right now - and that is displacing all FF generation. |
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Jun 2024
8:18pm, 24 Jun 2024
22,504 posts
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rf_fozzy
(No I don't think V2G is the solution either, although it may play a part).
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Jun 2024
12:41pm, 25 Jun 2024
88 posts
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Yakima Canutt
Curtailment is very relevant and the biggest cause of curtailment in the UK is the grid, particularly getting Scottish Wind energy (where it can usually be excess of Scottish demand) to England (where there is excess demand to take it). The grid cannot support the amount of new electricity from new offshore sources so it needs to be improved. Hence why there is lots of very large new pylons planned all over Scotland. But that will take time (years) and its lagging the production. No use having a Porsche if your roads are shit. |
Jun 2024
5:21pm, 26 Jun 2024
50,313 posts
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HappyG(rrr)
Tesco new store proposal, no petrol station, but instead an 18 bay rapid charger with food and beverages and rest stop? linkedin.com New normal?  G
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Jun 2024
5:29pm, 26 Jun 2024
20,223 posts
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Dave W
Indeed. Despite my own personal circs I am in favour of the change to EV's. A good mate has a company Merc EQA, and it's pretty nice, and pretty quick. I do worry about the grids ability to cope if everything is electric, and it will take a good push from Labour to get the renewable to a place where they supply the vast bulk of the electricity needed. |
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Jun 2024
5:37pm, 26 Jun 2024
50,314 posts
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HappyG(rrr)
I wonder what proportion of electric car charging is at night, from home battery or from solar? Mine is 95% plus from those sources. So nearly zero strain on the grid? G
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