Mar 2023
8:04pm, 4 Mar 2023
19,674 posts
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rf_fozzy
PH- Corbyn brought a fresh approach to labour politics, but like any populist (which is what his campaign turned out to be), his foundations were weak. He also didn't learn from the 2017 election, building on the thimgs that worked well and resonated and instead went for overboard with a bunch of unrealistic and undeliverable promises, leading to a lack of credibility. That plus the gaffes and the failure to deal with the rampant abuse and anti-Semitism from pockets on the far left made him unelectable. It may not be fair. But that's politics. Whilst Corbyn maintained support from the millennial and Gen Z electorate in 2019, he still lost significant portions of it for the same reasons he lost other sections of the electorate. In 2019 Corbyn was deeply unpopular across the electorate as a whole. Obviously getting more negative with increasing age. That wasn't the case in 2017. Hence the surprise result. Even the youth vote has broadly abandoned Corbyn. What Starmer has to do (and this is why the Tories are failing so spectacularly) is offer policies that are targeted at trying to row back some of the demographic war: childcare, fairer taxation (wealth tax), funding of public services etc. And house building. And yes eventually returning to our proper place in the EU with freedom of movement. Something overwhelmingly supported by younger voters. The Tories cannot do this. As the way their vote is structured with the older demographics being their core vote, any policies targeted at younger voters lose them more votes in the older demographics, because of the demographic war. |
Mar 2023
8:14pm, 4 Mar 2023
8,827 posts
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Fields
Why is everyone so keen on war in this thread?! I agree with some of what fozzy says, but really I think an enforced redistribution of wealth not just to the young but by location as well is probably the only solution. Starmer will be too timid, the Starmbots on here will no doubt say “save it for the second term” but how do you win one without making a success of the first one, and you do that by making bold radical change which has a measurable impact on people’s lives. However the tories usually win power by convincing enough of the electorate that they are in the upper middle class and wealthy, and that alternative governments would take all their money from them and they’d be poorer. It’s a lie but it is believed by enough people each time. Part of that is by dividing the working class eg demonising immigrants, trade Unions etc so the w/c turn on each other and don’t see who the real enemy is They won’t win this time round as everyone knows that isn’t the case due to Truss, but they’ll probably win the time after that because the vermin will rebrand. |
Mar 2023
9:46pm, 4 Mar 2023
14,403 posts
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jda
"And yes eventually returning to our proper place in the EU with freedom of movement." Please provide any scrap of evidence, even a vague rumour would do, that Starmer has offered any such thing, or even hinted at it. |
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Mar 2023
9:47pm, 4 Mar 2023
14,404 posts
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jda
Sorry I misread, I thought you had said Starmer was offering such policies, not that he has to do so!
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Mar 2023
9:50pm, 4 Mar 2023
21,133 posts
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richmac
Implosion theguardian.com |
Mar 2023
9:55pm, 4 Mar 2023
7,450 posts
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Pothunter
I’m not saying that anyone should disregard the youth, but if you don’t appeal across the board you won’t win.
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Mar 2023
9:58pm, 4 Mar 2023
19,679 posts
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rf_fozzy
Yes jda. But I'm not expecting it to be as quick as many would like under any circumstances. But ironically Sunak's deal offers the opportunity for Labour to go further. After all Sunak admitted that being in the SM is better.... But at some point, labour has to go full rejoin and jettison the lexiters finally. They can go howl at the moon as far as I'm concerned, because they just believe in a slightly different Unicorn to the hard right brexit crowd that they hitched their wagon too. How quickly labour get there is dependent on how much pressure can be brought to bear and how quickly public opinion recognises closer alignment and being in the EU is better and so forces the politicians to shift quicker. It also depends on demographic and electoral changes - if labour consistently gain the graduate vote and loses the "red wall" social conservatives vote, then their politics will change. Fast. |
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Mar 2023
10:11pm, 4 Mar 2023
8,829 posts
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Fields
I would like some evidence the red wall is socially conservative please other than your own innate prejudice against the working class
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Mar 2023
11:13pm, 4 Mar 2023
9,647 posts
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simbil
Here you go fields yougov.co.uk
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Mar 2023
11:18pm, 4 Mar 2023
9,648 posts
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simbil
^ red wall NOT any more socially conservative than rest of U.K. - just to be clear this is evidence for your position and not the contrary:)
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