Nov 2022
11:55am, 19 Nov 2022
18,790 posts
|
rf_fozzy
Yeah that was the graph that they showed to the Tory MP that was spouting off on BBC politics about how the UK had the best growth in the G7.... Brexiters are all reality deniers through and through. Speaking of which, have a listen to the 2 new episodes of The Coming Storm podcast about how the Qanon lunatic movement is morphing into the political system in America now that the original conspiracy theory has been debunked. Strikes me that they are *very* similar to Brexiters in their belief structure. Particularly about the way things are couched in a good (which is obviously them) vs an evil liberal establishment overlord regime. Which now includes the military as part of the conspiracy, which I expect has morphed out of the military-industrial complex rhetoric we see. I also found the way that James Linsday's ( en.wikipedia.org ) belief structure morphed into this conspiracy interesting and frightening. |
|
Nov 2022
11:55am, 19 Nov 2022
18,791 posts
|
rf_fozzy
Podcast page link is here: bbc.co.uk
|
Nov 2022
11:56am, 19 Nov 2022
19,723 posts
|
Chrisull
We've just talked about how Hannan scoffed at us losing single market access, and yet months later losing that was just the start of it, but the left (of which I am one) seem incapable of accepting that Starmer (or more likely a significant section of the party) can also game the system in the same way. Yes I'm sceptical that Starmer is some sort of Trojan Horse of socialism (spoiler: he isn't), but I definitely believe that voices in the party and of members/supporters can use pressure to drag a Labour party into more meaningful, socialistic action. Accepting the fiscal black hole is suicide, and no Labour govt winning in 2024 could do that and prosper. And they know that. However, the continued dialogue around austerity and the need for tightening our belts, is a hard orthodoxy to break, especially with a spooked market. Biden didn't exactly come from the left of the Dems, and yet I'd argue his policy successes so far place him to the left of Clinton and Obama... It ain't all lost, really folks. No govt is perfect, but some are way better than others. |
|
Nov 2022
11:57am, 19 Nov 2022
19,724 posts
|
Chrisull
fozzy - I'm listening to that right now, very very enlightening.
|
|
Nov 2022
12:05pm, 19 Nov 2022
18,792 posts
|
rf_fozzy
David Cameron's bid to kill off the hard/far right attack on the Tory party with Brexit is a complete and total failure. Based on Brexit purity of course. twitter.com |
|
Nov 2022
12:09pm, 19 Nov 2022
18,793 posts
|
rf_fozzy
Chris - denying reality won't help (see: Brexit). Whilst OBR forecasts may not always be brilliant, they're rarely totally wrong. So denying the structural issues in the economy is unhelpful. That doesn't mean fealty to austerity though. There are alternative paths and I am in now doubt that Labour under Starmer would do things differently. Labour currently have a 25-30% in the polls. What they need to do is avoid being stupid.... It may not be the perfect solution that many on here would prefer, but they'd be a million times better than the Tories. |
Nov 2022
12:19pm, 19 Nov 2022
28,924 posts
|
Johnny Blaze
One of Kwarteng's many errors was to sideline the OBR. It sends a certain signal about unwilligness to listen to experts. Labour shouldn't be trying to emulate that.
|
|
Nov 2022
12:22pm, 19 Nov 2022
18,795 posts
|
rf_fozzy
You only have to look at those calling for the OBR to be scrapped today - Jacob Rees-Mogg, Lance Foreman, Richard Tice, John Longworth etc.... Reality deniers all. |
Nov 2022
12:24pm, 19 Nov 2022
20,204 posts
|
richmac
Should rename it the office of budget reality
|
|
Nov 2022
12:25pm, 19 Nov 2022
18,796 posts
|
rf_fozzy
And for those wanting Labour to acknowledge and move on Brexit... twitter.com |
Useful Links
FE accepts no responsibility for external links. Or anything, really.Related Threads
-
Fantasy General Election
Jul 2024
-
EU Referendum - In or Out? Vote here
Aug 2018
-
March to Parliament Against Brexit - Sat 2nd July
Jun 2016
-
EU Referendum
Feb 2016
-
Ads on Fetch - anyone else getting Leave and Remain?!
Feb 2017
-
The Environment Thread :-)
Jan 2025
-
Economics
Jan 2025
-
Dear Scottish Fetchies
Jan 2023
-
Any economists out there - question
Oct 2022
-
Power and exploitation - please check my sanity
Oct 2018