Oct 2019
12:32pm, 3 Oct 2019
5,364 posts
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jda
J2R, what do you hope to see a ref on?
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Oct 2019
1:13pm, 3 Oct 2019
2,307 posts
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J2R
Very, very difficult, I know. But I think there would need to be a 2 stage referendum, with the first part being a straight Remain/Leave choice, and the 2nd, if Leave chosen, being between No Deal and whatever deal is on the table at that point (May's WA, for example). Or it could be the other way round - choose the Leave option first, and then pit that against Remain in the second part. Of course, this presupposes that there is a viable deal to go on the ballot, but May's WA could certainly be put forward. The fact that it didn't get through parliament is not especially relevant at this point, as the reason the 2nd ref would be happening is that nothing has got through parliament so we need a ref to move on. Appalling though it is to have No Deal on a ballot, I think it has to be there, to quash the whole 'Establishment stitch-up' line. If it is voted down, it loses its power to pollute politics here for the foreseeable future. |
Oct 2019
1:18pm, 3 Oct 2019
24,205 posts
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Wriggling Snake
I would go along with that, especially the leave/remain question first..then you are comparing like with like, 2016 v now. If remain wins now we remain, game over. If leave wins again we move on to how we leave. Probably what should use been done 3 years ago. I dare even say leaving might be discussed properly. However, none of this will happen. |
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Oct 2019
1:25pm, 3 Oct 2019
5,365 posts
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jda
Of all the possibilities, I'd say a two-stage ref under a caretaker govt prior to any GE is one of the more unlikely ones I've heard. The problem with May's deal AIUI isn't so much that it hasn't got through parliament (agree a ref could in principle add support to it) but rather that Corbyn has explicitly and repeatedly ruled it out under any circumstances as he wants to negotiate something closer to CU/SM membership (though he's still pretending not to be quite "inside" these). We could debate the possibility of changes to the political declaration covering that...but it seems a stretch to me. |
Oct 2019
2:13pm, 3 Oct 2019
3,559 posts
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run free
Think the relationship with the EU is too difficult for the common person to understand. Perhaps the 3 parties might have come up with a way for the people to identify: - Libs for Remain - Lab for another referendum - Tories for Leave ..and use an election to see which one the people will gravitate towards. Hence no referendum required. |
Oct 2019
2:27pm, 3 Oct 2019
8,897 posts
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larkim
This sounds like a rejection by Ireland to me:- "Ireland's Taoiseach Leo Varadkar lists five ways to avoid a north-south border: - A united Ireland - Ireland rejoining the UK - UK deciding to stay in the EU - The "Norway plus" model - The backstop "The best one is, of course, the backstop", he adds" If the Bojo proposal is not in that list, it goes in the bin. Though Johnson would probably pick number 2... |
Oct 2019
2:35pm, 3 Oct 2019
32,595 posts
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HappyG(rrr)
Lol, he's a card, that Leo!  G
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Oct 2019
2:44pm, 3 Oct 2019
32,596 posts
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HappyG(rrr)
Lol, have just seen today's Johnson gaff in Independent on FB - citing the Culham fusion energy research lab as a shining example of British engineering prowess, when it's an 88% EU funded project which will dry up in 2020 at end of Brexit transition! D'oh! G
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Oct 2019
2:45pm, 3 Oct 2019
32,597 posts
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HappyG(rrr)
independent.co.uk for giggles! G
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Oct 2019
2:55pm, 3 Oct 2019
3 posts
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Stevewjj
In a parallel world if the EU engage with Johnsons proposals there would have to be negotiations & counter proposals. If agreement was reached, in this parallel world, then there would have to be votes & legislation passed in both UK & EU. All before 31st Oct. For me the reality is there is not time - it is impossible to leave with a deal on 31st Oct. The only reality is an extension or No deal.
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