|
Oct 2024
11:35am, 29 Oct 2024
3,537 posts
|
Muttley
I saw the pictures of that sewage fountain. Very impressive, a few storeys high. A shitshow both literally and figuratively.
|
|
Nov 2024
8:14am, 6 Nov 2024
3,541 posts
|
Muttley
Well, with the orange man heading back to the White House, I have a sinking feeling that the US is going to abandon Ukraine. Putin will be rubbing his hands with glee. Perhaps Biden will empty the coffers and weapons stockpiles and remove all restrictions on their use as a parting present.
The future for Ukrainians does not look bright. And there will be major consequences for the rest of Europe including us, I fear.
Not a good day.
|
|
Nov 2024
8:16am, 6 Nov 2024
29,973 posts
|
richmac
I agree, American protectionism and isolationist policy will screw the world.
|
|
Nov 2024
8:38am, 6 Nov 2024
10,586 posts
|
Northern Exile
A dreadful day. I shudder to think what the future may bring.
|
|
Nov 2024
8:40am, 6 Nov 2024
68,790 posts
|
Derby Tup
Same here NE. Poor Zelensky
|
|
Nov 2024
9:12am, 6 Nov 2024
10,587 posts
|
Northern Exile
Yes, it will be a huge blow to Ukraine, but I was thinking in a broader context. The world is all of a sudden a much less safe place.
|
|
Nov 2024
9:25am, 6 Nov 2024
12,826 posts
|
lammo
I was thinking that too NE, will it have an effect on our defence budget / spending?
It feels like we will need to be more independent, as will much of Europe.
|
|
Nov 2024
9:34am, 6 Nov 2024
10,588 posts
|
Northern Exile
That's a good question. There is already a defence spending review in the wings and the truth is that it needs to be significantly increased in order to cope with the hugely increased threat from all directions. Intelligence spending too. The chances of getting that funding are slim, so I think you can draw your own conclusions there. I despair really.
|
|
Nov 2024
9:57am, 6 Nov 2024
3,542 posts
|
Muttley
The Balts and Poles understand and have been preparing - the Balts by beefing up their borders and trying to shut down the Russian fifth column in their midst, the Poles by ramping up their defence spending. The closer you are to Russia, the clearer you understand the threat.
What we in the western part of Europe need to understand is that if Ukraine falls our own security will be badly impacted and not only in the military sense. There will be an outflow of refugees and more subversion and sabotage by Russia (eg, those incendiary packages that are appearing in airport warehouses). This will spell social and political turmoil.
The only glimmer of hope is that a second term Trump will be wiser and less impulsive and maybe allow some grownups to run foreign and defence policy. I doubt that will happen but you never know.
Zelensky has congratulated Trump and clearly knows how to play the game but he must be despairing inside.
|
|
Nov 2024
10:33am, 6 Nov 2024
22,361 posts
|
Chrisull
Trump is "an agent of chaos" though, and it's not quite clear what he will bring. It may change weekly.
Weirdly having two authoritarian leaders with grudging but definite mutual respect, glowering across the Atlantic at each other **may** help keep a stalemate of sorts. I suspect leaving NATO is too much like hard work for Trump, and instead it will be neglected and other allies will be forced to cough up more (which most sides agree is a good thing).
Putin will have less sabre rattling to do about it, and might think about cutting his losses and seeing if he can get Crimea/Donbas and a guarantee of neutrality and be done with it. I don't like this solution, but Putin will be wary of Trump's randomness.
|
Helping Refugees
Apr 2022
