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Mar 2022
11:09am, 8 Mar 2022
36,404 posts
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SPR
Hmmm, I kind of get the logic in the sense of what's the benefit but at the same time saying that you wouldn't be recovered 3 weeks later because longer is harder seems a bit of a stretch.
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Mar 2022
11:15am, 8 Mar 2022
36,405 posts
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SPR
I would expect (within reason) faster work to make your legs feel better than longer and slower regardless of fatigue though so I can see why a 10km would be two weeks out.
Presumably based on what has been mentioned by others, the 12 mile MP should have been done weeks ago? Was it supposed to be a 20 mile run?
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Mar 2022
11:18am, 8 Mar 2022
36,406 posts
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SPR
Just re-read so you're considering a harder session than was programmed in the schedule because you're hoping for the best of both worlds? I'd say do one or the other and seems the experienced runners say just do the 20 miler.
Do you really need the confidence that the 12 mile MP could provide?
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Mar 2022
11:34am, 8 Mar 2022
17,267 posts
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larkim
I think that final Q is the key. When I've completed P&D successfully before and stood on the start line fit and confident (both being important) I've always had a 20 with 15 at MP under my belt as well as the scheduled races. The overall mileage and plan structure has always been in place too of course. In fact, in 2017 I did both the scheduled 15 with 12MP session AND the 20m race with 15 at MP, so I flexed the plan to my own ends anyway.
This time round if I don't do another extended MP session I'll be missing that session's confidence boost and I've not done the 10k races either. I should have had the Wrexham half in there but it was cancelled and I opted down to a 18 long run instead of using that as the trigger to go for a MP run (it was the storm weekend so I couldn't race that on my own!).
I don't think I carry fatigue noticeably for longer than 4 or 5 days, but I might be fooling myself there.
Best to stick to the plan I suppose!
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Mar 2022
12:19pm, 8 Mar 2022
36,407 posts
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SPR
You don't need to stick to the plan once you know what works for you but if everyone is saying don't do it, you need to be really sure.
Confidence is very important but the reality is every training run is run on current fitness and the benefit of that run is only felt later (admittedly 3 weeks is long enough to get that benefit).
In any case, speed is unlikely to be your issue with 3:15 so sticking to the plan (which focuses on endurance for the coming run) seems sensible.
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Mar 2022
12:32pm, 8 Mar 2022
17,271 posts
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larkim
Yes, my sensible head agrees that you're right. It's that odd thing of approaching a race where the one pace that I've not spent much time training at is the one pace I want to hold for 3 hours +. But I've learned to trust the training more, so I should just concentrate on the training being in the legs and let that build it's own confidence.
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Mar 2022
12:34pm, 8 Mar 2022
4,228 posts
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Curly45
I'm a believer in short taper, especially after a truncated build up, but you have to have the confidence that you will be able to ease off in the following days if you feel absolutely shattered after the long run with MP.
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Mar 2022
12:36pm, 8 Mar 2022
5,400 posts
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Windsor Wool
3 weeks out lark. 3 weeks!!
Folks would race a HM without particular issue. 12 @ MP is obviously easier and will give you the confidence boost you might crave.
I wouldn’t even have thought to wonder about it!
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Mar 2022
12:40pm, 8 Mar 2022
22,198 posts
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Bazoaxe
Its so long since I trained for a marathon I feel out of the loop on all this discussion  . I am actually not sure if I will do another and could be retiring on 24 plus 1 virtual. I will see how my sub 90 HM attempt goes in 10 days time and decide from there.
MP 3 weeks out I don't think is an issue. I did race an HM 3 weeks out once and had a stinker of a race. Was never sure if the HM PB was a factor but I haven't repeated that juts in case.
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Mar 2022
12:40pm, 8 Mar 2022
17,272 posts
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larkim
I've never experienced being shattered after a long run with MP; obviously during the day it's usually tired legs, but I've often done interval sessions the day after MP sessions (yes, I know, not recommended!) mainly due to family constraints etc and not had an issue once I've done a decent warm up. That's what makes me think I could handle a MP session, even if it was just for mental reassurance, without impacting the race.
But sticking to the plan makes sense too. And if I did do an MP session and then pick up a niggle, I'd not be able to show my face around here
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