The Sub 3:15 Marathon Thread
334 watchers
Apr 2019
10:51am, 1 Apr 2019
7,197 posts
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larkim
Hmmm. Discretion? Where do you draw the line? According to Tim Grose, Dinton gets an average SSS of 3.81 vs Woodley 1.81 so it is definitely "harder". Then it's about quantifying what 2.00 difference in performance is equal to. I might be wrong here, but I think for a 5k, 1.0 on a basic score equates to a change of about 28/29s (interpreting this from my results - 7.6 score = 18:58, 9.0 score = 19:40, 11.8 score = 21:00 when I use the "debug=y" option on RBR). So your assumption that it is about 1 minute slower seems to hold water. But if we're going to get into adjusting everyone's times for the relative SSS of each course, that way madness lies!! My regular course is a 2.5 according to facebook.com so I should get a few seconds handicap added, as my fastest times weren't at that venue. I think the moral is - choose your parkrun carefully! So I reckon we all sit back, give ourselves the moral highground for running harder courses which don't help us in this bit of fun and then once a month choose a fast course if you really can't bear to be low down the leaderboard! 
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Apr 2019
11:24am, 1 Apr 2019
14,416 posts
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Chrisull
Paul - ta, yes I had a sub 6 minute mile in there at mile 5, which ends up on the beach and soft sand. On the second hill I saw the first lady, just ahead of me, walking - I didn't walk any of it, but I couldn't catch her when she started running again and my glutes paid the price, incredibly sore today (which shows how strength work has altering my running, normally it would be my calves that took the punishment). I notice on Strava's assessment of the segment, it tops out at 20.5% on a corner. there is certainly a stretch of 15% after a solid 10% start. I am a changed runner to a couple of years ago, the choices made for Stratford are pretty much locked down, I know what I'm capable of, I just need to stick to them, discipline will be rigid on the day. I am having to consider my mental preparation is gonna play a key aspect. It was good yesterday, I ran between 11th and 14th the whole race, but one of the club's most experienced guys pointed out I should have taken 12th, I mentally conceded a couple of places in the last 400m, when I had others on the racks. I need to address that. |
Apr 2019
11:40am, 1 Apr 2019
30,973 posts
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HappyG(rrr)
Larks, explain SSS and vSSS to me please? Event Time Race SSS vSSS Date parkrun 21:43 Vogrie parkrun # 94 4.6 1.7 2 Feb 19 + parkrun 20:23 Perth parkrun # 277 1.0 2.6 2 Mar 19 + parkrun 21:38 Lochore Meadows parkrun # 35 3.6 2.5 26 Jan 19 + parkrun 21:03 Kirkcaldy parkrun # 206 2.2 2.8 9 Feb 19 + parkrun 20:49 Lochore Meadows parkrun # 9 4.0 0.5 14 Jul 18 + Does that mean that 20:49 at Lochore 14 July 18 was better (vSSS of 0.5) than 20:23 at Perth 2 Mar 2019 (vSSS of 1.0) ? Confused.com G
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Apr 2019
11:50am, 1 Apr 2019
4,164 posts
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jda
I looked into this in some detail recently. The short answer is, you need to add "&debug=y" to the end of the URL for your results to actually work out how (relatively) well you did in each race. A point on SSS is worth about 30s over 5k as larkim said (and a minute on 10k etc). However the vSSS depends on what RBR reckons your own relevant PB score is, and this may change over time even if your PB does not. The debug page has a column showing the the difference between your actual score (ie your time on the scale used) and the score for the event. It's not quite how I would have designed a handicap system, but seems to hang together reasonably well. |
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Apr 2019
11:56am, 1 Apr 2019
7,198 posts
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larkim
Perth's event on that day scored 1.0 as a SSS whereas Lochore in July scored 4.0. So on that day in Lochore, most people ran significantly slower than their best, indicating it was either a hard course, a hard day, a long course etc etc. So even though your performances were similar you get more RBR credit for running closer to your best on a hard day than you do for running on the easier day. That does seem like an unusually "hard" day at Lochore, and you could just have lucked into running well on a day when all the "good" runners were taking it easy. |
Apr 2019
12:10pm, 1 Apr 2019
307 posts
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snayak
I'm in a similar situation to CW. Last year's best time was on a panflat course (Heslington) compared to my regular run at Gateshead which is hilly! Not marathon training at the moment so I'm enjoying breaking myself every week at parkrun. However, I do plan another 3:15 attempt in January 2019. |
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Apr 2019
12:13pm, 1 Apr 2019
308 posts
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snayak
Er...January 2020!
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Apr 2019
12:24pm, 1 Apr 2019
30,975 posts
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HappyG(rrr)
Thanks for explanation Larks. I've never done well at Lochore. It's flat (a couple of v small ups n downs in last km), trail but not muddy, no tight twists, not congested, exposed to wind, but these days weren't too windy, so really can't understand why it's a 4.0 (or 3.6 on another line in there). Unless it's long?! Which could happen of course, but I haven't heard any others moaning about it. I'm going to go find a known hard one that I've done up here and see how it compares... G
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Apr 2019
12:31pm, 1 Apr 2019
30,976 posts
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HappyG(rrr)
And jda for explanation too. Soz! G
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Apr 2019
12:54pm, 1 Apr 2019
7,201 posts
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larkim
The interesting thing about Lochore is that according to Tim Grose, it has an average / median / modal (not sure which) SSS score of 2.7 so you clearly turned on a difficult day (or a day where everyone was cruising).
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