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Sub 19 Min 5k Thread

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Windsor Wool Nov 2024 8:39am, 26 Nov 2024 6,555 posts	Quote Pin Windsor Wool For me, VO2max intervals form an integral part of a well-structured training program that includes all the other bits that we all know and do / have done. I find that a lot of newer runners jump to interval sessions way too early in their running careers or when they would have much more effective ways of improving their speed - perhaps by simply running more. Totally understandable as it's what running clubs do and in your mind running fast in training should result in running fast in races, shouldn't it? Just running more isn't sexy and we're all looking for a shortcut. So, I get why it happens. To hit @Charlesvdw's point more properly, there are definitely some short sessions that I have avoided for years. Maximal 200s / 400s have been a no-go for me and in some cases I've even been wary of running strides. I've not shyed away from 800s and up though so maybe it's less the VO2max element that has concerned me and more the 'sprint' nature you can fall in to with the really short stuff. I think that's also a trap that folks fall in to - running intervals too quickly and so really short stuff really does become an all out calf / hamstring puller! But, there is a bit of evidence out there that real high intensity stuff is very effective for older athletes. If you haven't read Richard Askwith's book The Race Against Time then I would really recommend it. The stories in there are hugely inspirational / motivational for the older athlete and there are also plenty of links to academic studies that have looked at the impacts. I never read books, never, but this was a really important read for me and something that the usual FE faces would probably benefit from reading. Easy bike today after a few short hill sprints yesterday!
Mark J 🇳🇿 Nov 2024 8:52am, 26 Nov 2024 7,613 posts	Quote Pin Mark J 🇳🇿 Useful reading tip. On it. Thanks.
Mark J 🇳🇿 Nov 2024 8:53am, 26 Nov 2024 7,614 posts	Quote Pin Mark J 🇳🇿 And yes, mileage has definitely been a significant game changer these last two years fur me after 14 years of hobby running, if guess you'd call it.
larkim Nov 2024 9:40am, 26 Nov 2024 26,183 posts	Quote Pin larkim When I kicked on from being a 15mpw-but-still-sub-20/sub-90 runner I think I was probably already doing tempo (without realising it), because I did a lot of those 15mpw runs "fast". I got my first boost to the "next level" (sub 19) by doing volume for a 33 mile ultra, before I'd run a marathon. Little speedwork in there, just easy consistent running. Then did my first marathon and the big difference was adding both the strides and the VO2Max stuff in following P&D. That took me on to the next level again (18:14). I don't find fast intervals or strides worrisome in terms of injury risk. That's probably just my mental conception of them. Where I do find myself veering away from them is when I'm unhappy with my overall fitness, and I dislike seeing "slower" times on the intervals. Again, very mental!
jda Nov 2024 10:45am, 26 Nov 2024 18,166 posts	Quote Pin jda I was going to say I never did VO2max sessions but I possibly did when doing intervals with the club back in the 20-teens when I was going well. Who knows, maybe that was the secret sauce? Not sure they were quite hard enough really. It was mostly miles and threshold for sure.
larkim Nov 2024 11:16am, 26 Nov 2024 26,184 posts	Quote Pin larkim I'm firmly of the opinion is that which works best is that which you enjoy, or have at least positive impact expectations from. And I'm learning that some things which I previously would have dismissed I actually quite enjoy so I'm feeling moderately open minded too. Moderately.
Charlesvdw Nov 2024 11:22am, 26 Nov 2024 475 posts	Quote Pin Charlesvdw Great input on training. I may be biased because intervals at 5k to HM pace are a major risk factor for injury in my case. I learned that the hard way. So I mostly stick to easy running and MP. Some strides for the neuromuscular benefit twice a month, and no more than four 30/30 strides in one easy run.
Windsor Wool Nov 2024 11:33am, 26 Nov 2024 6,556 posts	Quote Pin Windsor Wool @larkim so full of natural talent. I’m so full of envy!! The mind is interesting. stand back and think about the fact that you don’t want to run intervals as you might be off the pace yet you are willing to wallow through the mud at XC for all to see you coming in minutes behind where you might be at full fitness, miles behind where you might be at full potential!!
Windsor Wool Nov 2024 11:35am, 26 Nov 2024 6,557 posts	Quote Pin Windsor Wool And btw, I’ve often marvelled at how quick you run your reps. Perhaps that’s coz you only run them when you’re very fit 😂!!
larkim Nov 2024 11:59am, 26 Nov 2024 26,186 posts	Quote Pin larkim My biggest nagging doubt at the moment is weight. For various reasons, mostly work related, I've been eating a bit more and running a bit less, so I'm at about 77kg consistently at the moment. Towards the end of a properly committed P&D plan I'll be down at about 72kg. 7% extra body weight is a lot to be carrying around! As for XC, that's part of the "new things" I'm open to. I'd always done club racing for my 1st claim over XC when my kids were also running (and I was fit). I'd abandoned XC since the kids grew out of it / left home, and didn't fancy second claiming on the XC with Helsby. But decided to give a few a go this year, and enjoyed them, even the slop of Sefton Park (though tbh that was as much an excuse to get out of work during the day, as I'd been called in on a Saturday!). In terms of "talent", there's definitely something in my wife and my gene pool; offspring ran 1:10:52 in a low key half ("as a hard training effort", according to him!) at the weekend, so if his genes have come from ours then we must have something good going on. In my case, it's not physique though - so it must be aerobic capacity which is naturally pretty good.