Pro cycling thread
83 watchers
Sep 2023
1:06pm, 14 Sep 2023
20,692 posts
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Chrisull
Will check it out. Also thought experiment. Say Kuss lost the lead by 2 seconds yesterday to Jonas (ie just another 10 seconds). The next day Jonas crashes midway, JV wait up for him, he gets back on. But on the final climb he struggles, and gets dropped near the end. Rog wants to push on. Only Sep is left with him. What should he do??? Jonas is going as team leader, you should stay... I'm sure larks has an easy answer for us... |
Sep 2023
1:13pm, 14 Sep 2023
42,627 posts
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SPR
I just don't see how the "cycling norms" perspective of "don't attack the leader" can then marry up with the concept of JV and PR not being doms for SK. They are either riding in support of him because he has the red jersey and that's "just the way its done" (and are therefore doms) or they are allowed to attack him and not ride in support of him (unless they are simply attacking only as a result of defending the jersey for the team by covering off another team's rider's attack. It's pretty easy IMO, the doms are the other 5, Kuss, Roglic and Vingegaard are protected. If another team attacks they cover. They can take opportunities provided by an opponent but not actively attack the leader which is why the ex pros are in unison about what happened yesterday. On Tuesday there was at least plausible deniability (Vingegaard's attack should have forced the others to chase but UAE were playing odd games (more the fact it wasn't the pre stage plan and seemed to usurp a plan for Roglic that has me questioning it)). Yesterday there was no need for Vingegaard to follow Roglic and even Roglic could have slowed as he'd still likely have won the stage as Landa was unlikely to be a threat in a sprint. |
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Sep 2023
1:15pm, 14 Sep 2023
42,628 posts
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SPR
Will check it out. Also thought experiment. Say Kuss lost the lead by 2 seconds yesterday to Jonas (ie just another 10 seconds). The next day Jonas crashes midway, JV wait up for him, he gets back on. But on the final climb he struggles, and gets dropped near the end. Rog wants to push on. Only Sep is left with him. What should he do??? Jonas is going as team leader, you should stay... I'm sure larks has an easy answer for us... If I'm Kuss, I'm continuing. If he's dropped by opps, then that's the scenario where other riders can take their chances. |
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Sep 2023
1:17pm, 14 Sep 2023
42,629 posts
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SPR
Have a listen to the Escape Collective emergency podcast for their take. Part of it was pointing out how Kuss was reflecting how he'd learnt more race tactics from the last two weeks What episode? Is this an interview with Kuss? |
Sep 2023
1:20pm, 14 Sep 2023
2,553 posts
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MsG
podcasts.google.com This episode, they're reflecting on Kuss's interviews. |
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Sep 2023
1:21pm, 14 Sep 2023
2,554 posts
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MsG
Not sure how I gave the impression it was an interview with Kuss?
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Sep 2023
1:27pm, 14 Sep 2023
42,631 posts
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SPR
Probably more an assumption on my part, I posted one from Domestique where they interviewed Kuss on the first rest day so thought there was a possibility he'd do that with others.
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Sep 2023
1:45pm, 14 Sep 2023
42,632 posts
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SPR
With the gap today now it's surely settled. Will be interesting to hear what they say today after taking stock.
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Sep 2023
2:00pm, 14 Sep 2023
42,633 posts
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SPR
Listening now and it's adding to my theory that Tuesday by Vingegaard was what set this up and it's not really Kuss but a Vingegaard Vs Roglic issue.
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Sep 2023
2:05pm, 14 Sep 2023
20,693 posts
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Chrisull
I'm with your position SPR, but I was taking by implication larks wouldn't be, he'd been with Ving? Or at least have some tricky explaining to do?
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