Jun 2024
9:31pm, 21 Jun 2024
162 posts
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Joe1970
I'm firmly on the remain side of the Brexit debate...but it also seems clear to me that the Ukraine war was very much provoked by NATO expansion. That doesn't mean I don't think Putin isn't a murderous scumbag, but NATO are hardly innocent here. Decent summary at theconversation.com
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Jun 2024
9:34pm, 21 Jun 2024
5,378 posts
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paulcook
I'm going to open a can of worms here, but can NATO - partly as a defensive alliance, partly because it just accepts membership requests - actually expand? Least of all provoke?
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Jun 2024
9:48pm, 21 Jun 2024
28,084 posts
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richmac
NATO has never started a war, NATO has never invaded any country. Never. NATO has never funded separatists in neighbouring countries NATO came into being to counter Russian expansion. Counties neighboring Russia were concerned by Russian apparent desire to recapture it's old empire they asked to Join NATO. Ukraine was not a member of NATO, there were no NATO weapons in Ukraine Ukraine was effectively a buffer zone between Russia and NATO. So please don't waste time sharing utter shite. |
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Jun 2024
9:56pm, 21 Jun 2024
5,380 posts
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paulcook
Well that's a very firm attempt to close that can of worms!
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Jun 2024
9:58pm, 21 Jun 2024
11,276 posts
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Fields
richmac wrote: NATO has never started a war, NATO has never invaded any country. Never. NATO has never funded separatists in neighbouring countries Have any NATO members ever done these things? |
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Jun 2024
9:58pm, 21 Jun 2024
11,277 posts
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Fields
Perhaps Palestine should be immediately invited to join NATO, it might stop the slaughter
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Jun 2024
10:04pm, 21 Jun 2024
28,085 posts
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richmac
Sorry PC that wasn't aimed at you
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Jun 2024
10:07pm, 21 Jun 2024
5,381 posts
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paulcook
richmac wrote: Sorry PC that wasn't aimed at you I know. But you answered my question very well to be honest. |
Jun 2024
11:19pm, 21 Jun 2024
22,479 posts
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rf_fozzy
Bill lives on a small housing development and quite often annoys his neighbours by repeatedly destroying flowerbeds, being abusive and shouting at his neighbours, because he thought, wrongly that all the 'common land' belonged to him. Some time ago, Sally, Dave and Ahmed formed a residents association because they didnt like their garden areas being destroyed and Bill's behaviour. And over time they became friendly and even had each other over for BBQs and shared gardening tools and things. Sam, Samira, Beata and Nina actually had gardens that bordered Bill's and bore the brunt of his unpleasantness but didn't initially join the association Over time, Sam and Samira decided to join the association as they thought the benefits were worth it and we're afraid Bill (who is a big chap) might get physical and the residents association gave them a way to his behaviour, but not in such a way that they were left isolated. This was the situation for many years. Sam was particularly close to the group and often joined them for their street parties, but didn't want to join the association because with his garden neighbouring Bill's, he didn't want to have any aggro. Then a few years ago, Bill decided he would claim part of Beata's garden - just a small bit, at the back, because it meant he'd have room for a bigger bin store and Beata wasn't using it. He also decided to aggressively chop the hedge between his garden and Beata's, and throw the rubbish over. Beata protested, but despite a few strongly worded letters, the association didn't do anything because Beata wasn't a member. Then last week, Bill decided to lay claim to all Beata's garden and although he didn't get into the house, he's fenced off a huge chunk of her garden. Sam was very concerned about this because his garden on the other side has a pile of wood and fence panels against the current exisiting fence. And so he has joined the residents association for some security and moral support When asked about all this, Bill said, and was supported by some people in the next street that he was provoked in occupying Beata's garden by the residents association. |
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Jun 2024
11:21pm, 21 Jun 2024
22,480 posts
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rf_fozzy
Also DNFTT
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