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Oct 2019
12:41pm, 31 Oct 2019
22,858 posts
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Johnny Blaze
Yep.
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Oct 2019
12:44pm, 31 Oct 2019
8,252 posts
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simbil
Tommy, it’s not whether the vote would win but whether there have been significant changes that merit another vote surely?
Corbyn should abandon his idea of negotiating a red Brexit and putting it to a referendum.
The only clear position to take is ref on Tory Brexit vs remain.
Lib Dem’s are right to contest labour seats as it stands, Corbyn cannot be trusted on Brexit.
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Oct 2019
12:46pm, 31 Oct 2019
2,392 posts
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TomahawkMike
I cant see BP putting up candidates in any Tory marginals.
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Oct 2019
1:08pm, 31 Oct 2019
27,095 posts
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macca 53
The only parties unequivocally remain are Lib Dems and Greens.
Labour’s policy has remained unchanged since the last election; leave with a CU and the confirmatory referendum. I don’t see why that would be regarded as “untrustworthy” - especially in comparison to “no deal is better than a bad deal” or “dead in a ditch”......
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Oct 2019
1:16pm, 31 Oct 2019
9,350 posts
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larkim
The problem with Corbyn's approach is not so much that it isn't logical or ideologically consistent, it's that it just appears to be a fudge which doesn't allow the current binary view of Brexit to fall in on one side or the other.
It won't win over a Brexiter, it won't win over a Remainer, it just possibly makes some robustly Labour voters who are strong Remainers maintain their vote (and potentially the same for Brexit Labour voters). It shores up a base potentially, and is easily presented in the press as confused, opaque, dithering compared to Bojo's position on his deal or Swinson's position on Remain.
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Oct 2019
1:27pm, 31 Oct 2019
8,253 posts
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simbil
Will Corbyn campaign for red Brexit or remain in a referendum, or be neutral?
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Oct 2019
1:31pm, 31 Oct 2019
9,351 posts
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larkim
That's the nub of the problem in terms of presenting it to the electorate. "I'll negotiate a great deal which has these components - etc etc - but if I fail at negotiating I'll recommend you reject it in a subsequent referendum, and if I succeed in negotiating you'll see me recommending Leave in a way which I didn't do under the previous referendum".
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Oct 2019
1:32pm, 31 Oct 2019
9,352 posts
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larkim
As I say, it's not illogical or non-pragmatic in principle. But convincing people that it is a policy worth positively voting for is another matter.
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Oct 2019
1:38pm, 31 Oct 2019
29,584 posts
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SPR
TBF, it might be explainable on the doorstep and having more than Brexit to talk about is a good thing.
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Oct 2019
1:51pm, 31 Oct 2019
167 posts
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TommyK
"Tommy, it’s not whether the vote would win but whether there have been significant changes that merit another vote surely?"
Indeed, Simbil. It was continually stated that the only way Scotland could remain in the EU was to remain in the UK. How'd that work out for us? So, I'd argue that the Brexit referendum result was more then enough reason to rerun the Independence Referendum.
However, we're dealing with politicians. And I'd suspect that a second Independence referendum really would be it for a generation, so, they're not likely to run one unless they've a pretty good chance of winning it and I don't think that's where we are, even allowing for ongoing, passive "encouragement" from Westminster.
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Fantasy General Election
Jul 2024
