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Polarized training

91 watchers
SPR
Aug 2020
5:23pm, 5 Aug 2020
30,757 posts
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SPR
Kieran - The ECG issue followed by ankle injury must have been frustrating but good that you're back on it now.

Seems like decent plans to start with just make sure you have the base to improve on the race (I'm assuming) plans. Smart training will pay off eventually.

HOD - Sounds like you were looking for a magic bullet. Wouldn't expect a coach to come up with anything that looks radical. What they'd hopefully do is build a plan that you can consistently improve on and help you react correctly when things need to change.
Aug 2020
5:25pm, 5 Aug 2020
71,008 posts
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Gobi
We talked a bit about it.

That wasn't a plan :-)
Aug 2020
5:46pm, 5 Aug 2020
3,982 posts
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Kieren
Yeah - it took me year to figure out the ankle root cause. Physios would blame weak glutes or hamstrings so I started barbell weight training which helped but the issue would come back. In the end I found it seemed to be foot arch collapsing over time which resulted in other lower leg muscles fatiguing and vulnerability to ankle sprains. I did some drills to strengthen the arch , resulting in a smaller shoe size and so far, so good.

Every time I end up in hospital my heart causes a few escalations (nurse, DR, cardiologist, Snr cardiologist) so I keep some results on google cloud now to explain & notes with my ICE details. I know it should be on patient file but my name always get spelt incorrectly.

-------------

J2R - curious about your impressive marathon times from low volume running. Do you recall if you were active in other ways at the time - like lots or walking or manual labour, like gardening etc?
J2R
Aug 2020
6:18pm, 5 Aug 2020
2,877 posts
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J2R
Kieren, no, running was the only serious physical activity I was doing at the time. I'm a software developer so spend hours in front of a computer, pretty well the exact opposite from manual labour in terms of benefits. I actually last ran a marathon in 2012 but mean to have another go in the next couple of years. For the last few years I've been focussing on half marathon, trying to beat 1:20 (so far I've run 1:20:13, 1:20:10, 1:20:03 twice, and then 1:20:00 last year :( ). If I achieve this (or give up trying) I'll switch back to marathons and have a go at sub-2:55.

I would say I'm pretty careful about my training and make the most of what mileage I do. But as I said, I do appear to be by good fortune physiologically well-adapted to running, so what works for me might not necessarily work for others.
Aug 2020
8:02pm, 5 Aug 2020
3,983 posts
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Kieren
SPR, thanks. Thats interesting. 01:20:00 - Oh that must have been so annoying.

If you happen to be course chasing and ever fancy a trip to SW London, the club Ranelagh Harriers put on a flat half marathon May (when they are allowed again). It's used to have a cap of 1000 runners, so not too congested. It starts at 8:30AM, so tends to be less impacted by heat and there are often a good bunch of club runners around that pace to chase down or fend off.
ranelagh-half-marathon.co.uk

I'm sure there must be a league table for fast UK half-marathons somewhere
Aug 2020
10:01pm, 5 Aug 2020
35,027 posts
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Hills of Death (HOD)
They are all excellent times J but yes keep plugging away.

Do you do tempo runs on your polarised training.

Yes Gobi it wasn’t foolishly I felt it would be but rod of that now.
J2R
Aug 2020
10:18am, 8 Aug 2020
2,883 posts
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J2R
Sorry, HOD, missed your question there.

No, I wouldn't say I do tempo runs as such on my polarised training programme, if by tempo runs we mean something like 20-25 minutes continuous running at a pace one could sustain for an hour (in my case around 6:00 mins/mile), a fairly standard definition. It's not really part of polarised training and I certainly never plan to go out for one. However, before lockdown hit, I would usually do a parkrun on weekends when I wasn't racing, and that's not a million miles away from a tempo run. OK, it's at 5K pace, not 10 mile pace, and it's for 17-19 minutes, not 20 or more, but I imagine it is largely working the same systems.

Also, as a half marathon approaches, I will try to do some race pace segments, so I might do a 12 mile easy run, say, but with miles 7-11 at target race pace, which is a few seconds slower per mile than standard tempo pace but not far off. So in effect that might count as a tempo run.
J2R
Aug 2020
10:19am, 8 Aug 2020
2,884 posts
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J2R
Kieren, thanks for the suggestion. I'll have a look at that one when things get going again.
Aug 2020
10:18pm, 8 Aug 2020
35,030 posts
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Hills of Death (HOD)
What I was doing when I was fitter was one speed session a week 5k pace so around 18-20 mins broke up in 1 or 2 min slots. Also my parkrun tended to be around Tempo pace 22-23 mins.
Aug 2020
6:28pm, 10 Aug 2020
3,990 posts
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Kieren
What happens to polarised training in the heat? Is an easy paces still "easy" or is the additional stress on the body bringing it closer to the middle?

On the first of our 34 degree days, I run at zone 2 pace and was in zone 4 after about 10 minutes. So I accept the heart is working a lot harder but i am not pushing clocse to threshold, cooling is just taking up other resources.

Further runs have been much less demanding, it seems heat adaption happens pretty quickly.

About This Thread

Maintained by Canute
Polarised training is a form of training that places emphasis on the two extremes of intensity. There is a large amount of low intensity training (comfortably below lactate threshold) and an appreciable minority of high intensity training (above LT).

Polarised training does also include some training near lactate threshold, but the amount of threshold training is modest, in contrast to the relatively high proportion of threshold running that is popular among some recreational runners.

Polarised training is not new. It has been used for many years by many elites and some recreational runners. However, it has attracted great interest in recent years for two reasons.

First, detailed reviews of the training of many elite endurance athletes confirms that they employ a polarised approach (typically 80% low intensity, 10% threshold and 10% high intensity. )

Secondly, several scientific studies have demonstrated that for well trained athletes who have reached a plateau of performance, polarised training produces greater gains in fitness and performance, than other forms of training such as threshold training on the one hand, or high volume, low intensity training on the other.

Much of the this evidence was reviewed by Stephen Seiler in a lecture delivered in Paris in 2013 .
vimeo.com

In case you cannot access that lecture by Seiler in 2013, here is a link to his more recent TED talk.

ted.com
This has less technical detail than his 2013 talk, but is nonetheless a very good introduction to the topic. It should be noted that from the historical perspective, Seiler shows a US bias.

Here is another useful video by Stephen Seiler in which he discusses the question of the optimum intensity and duration of low intensity sessions. Although the answer ‘depends on circumstances’ he proposes that a low intensity session should be long enough to reach the point where there are detectable indications of rising stress (either the beginning of upwards drift of HR or increased in perceived effort). If longer than this, there is increasing risk of damaging effects. A session shorter than this might not be enough to produce enough stress to achieve a useful training effect.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GXc474Hu5U


The coach who probably deserves the greatest credit for emphasis on the value of low intensity training was Arthur Lydiard, who coached some of the great New Zealanders in the 1960's and Scandinavians in the 1970’s. One of his catch-phrases was 'train, don't strain'. However Lydiard never made it really clear what he meant by ‘quarter effort’. I have discussed Lydiard’s ideas on several occasions on my Wordpress blog. For example: canute1.wordpress.com
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