Over 50's club

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LazyDaisy Apr 2018 2:41pm, 9 Apr 2018 22,060 posts	0 LazyDaisy Thank you Canute. I shall stick to my 'no marathons' decision then I think!
Velociraptor Apr 2018 2:59pm, 9 Apr 2018 38,078 posts	0 Velociraptor I'm fairly sure I'm done with marathons for a while. I can't be bothered with anything that requires a big commitment in terms of recovery time. Cycling has got me spoiled. Besides, I haven't even had time to train adequately for a ten-miler this year.
DocMoye Apr 2018 5:02pm, 9 Apr 2018 21,407 posts	0 DocMoye Thanks Canute. That is interesting. I’ve only run one marathon, I trained hard and ran my best. I genuinely feel it took me 6 months to recover. I now race more frequently but half marathon as max distance, never train or race as hard as I did then but always recover quickly. So I could do better but I enjoy my running much more this way. And that is the point for me as I’m not going to win any medals. As for the HRM I use it sporadically and usually find a good correlation with HR and perceived effort which is good to know.
WtnMel Apr 2018 11:53am, 10 Apr 2018 1,012 posts	0 WtnMel Like LD, I've never felt the need to run a marathon - 10 milers and HM's are enough for me to feel happy with what I achieve (and that is purely subjective as I'm a back-third of the race 'plodder' happy with what I'm doing). I was curious about HRM training in the past but was aware of other runners complaining that they struggled to keep their HRM low enough on 'easy' runs. So I made the decision (with no medical or any other evidence) that concentrating purely on HRM was probably a waste of time. I decided to stick to a combination of my perceived effort and breathing rate to 'tell' myself how I was doing on a run. But to still wear a HRM strap so that I can occasionally do some post-run analysis of how my heart rate compared to how I felt when running.
steve45 Apr 2018 4:28pm, 10 Apr 2018 2,485 posts	0 steve45 Thanks Canute as always for a great run down (excuse the pun) of the factors we need to be aware of. I note that In Tim Noake's book "Lore of Running" (a bit dated maybe but a lot of principles still worth taking on board) he clearly states the likelihood of only two marathons a year being ideal....that is if they are RACED. That stress element and over training/recovery you mention I agree is something a lot of runners don't account for--however maybe not a lot of recreational runners (like me now) don't run at race pace and full effort these days. Another factor which we all know about too is the somewhat inappropriate training distances/ training paces they put in when they are trying to improve or do a pb at a specific distance--but that's for the bookworms (me!) to decipher and follow or talk things through with a coach. I'm with you on what you're saying Doc Moye too.
GlennR Apr 2018 12:53pm, 11 Apr 2018 34,911 posts	0 GlennR I've made a few notes about training, with the emphasis on crumblies, on my blog today. I didn't want to clutter the thread with it, but it may be of interest.
LazyDaisy Apr 2018 2:39pm, 11 Apr 2018 22,081 posts	0 LazyDaisy Crumblies? How very dare you
Columba Apr 2018 7:18pm, 11 Apr 2018 15,322 posts	0 Columba We're survivors, not crumblies.
Canute Apr 2018 11:01pm, 11 Apr 2018 1,873 posts	0 Canute Glen, As we discussed in the comments on your blog, it is interesting to speculate that a light training session might actually be better than a rest-day for promoting recovery under many circumstances. I know of at least one study that found that a swimming recovery session 10 hours after high intensity running resulted in less biochemical evidence of stress and better running performance on the following day (Lum et al, Int J Sports Med. 2010;31:26-30). From the physiological appoint of view it might make sense for two reasons: 1) even during light exercise, muscle blood flow is much greater than at rest, and blood flow will provide nutrients for healing and also clear away cellular debris; 2) at sites of microscopic muscle damage, gentle muscle contraction might promote laying down of collagen fibres aligned along the direction of pull if the muscle, and minimise obstructive adhesions. Many coaches, ranging from Lydiard, who recommends ¼ effort sessions, to Parker, who specifies HR in the low intensity zone (and even Canova, coach of elite Kenyans) regard easy recovery runs as an important component of a distance runner’s training program. However any recovery session must be suitably light to avoid confounding damage. Although HR can be a useful guide, the stress of a session depends on both intensity and duration. Lydiard’s ¼ effort session is a session that you could comfortably repeat immediately afterwards. This implies that once you feel any sense of accumulating fatigue, you have done enough. I wonder whether low intensity running might be even better than swimming for active recovery, provided the intensity is low enough, because it plausible that contraction of muscles in a way that mimics as closely as possible the action of running is likely to be the most effective for muscle recovery. Walking or even cycling are likely to have some of the benefits due moderate similarity in muscle usage, but without stressful concentric contraction.
Canute Apr 2018 7:52am, 12 Apr 2018 1,874 posts	0 Canute oops, eccentric, not concentric.