Transgender exercise - Lets Fetch Everyone

1 lurker | 80 watchers
3 Aug
4:40pm, 3 Aug 2024
343 posts
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Charlesvdw
@HappyG(rrr) we're continuing the debate in the Olympics thread.

The boxers are not transgender people and the purpose of this thread is solely for supporting transgender exercise.
3 Aug
4:51pm, 3 Aug 2024
43,489 posts
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Nellers
Spot on, Vixx.
3 Aug
4:59pm, 3 Aug 2024
11,957 posts
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Raemondo
Vixx wrote:Has ANYONE given a thought to what may happen to this athlete if she tries to go home and then has to deal with a fraction of what is going out now, with people repeating unchecked social media information? Regardless of her actual genetic situation, she could be in danger. Does anyone care about that?


Certainly not the usual suspects like Rowling, because they don't actually care about women's safety 😔
3 Aug
6:51pm, 3 Aug 2024
344 posts
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Charlesvdw
I wouldn't worry about her safety, she will be a national hero in her country. To them she is a regular woman.
The only women I worry about are her opponents.
3 Aug
6:53pm, 3 Aug 2024
41,481 posts
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halfpint
Really well said Vixx. People seem to forget there is a person at the heart of this. I’m bothered by the number of people drawing and sharing definitive conclusions about an issue they cannot possibly have all of the information about.
3 Aug
6:54pm, 3 Aug 2024
11,959 posts
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Raemondo
Yay, kittens.
3 Aug
7:59pm, 3 Aug 2024
11,960 posts
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Raemondo
At the risk of being off topic, this made me do a mildly amused smirk

3 Aug
8:27pm, 3 Aug 2024
2,372 posts
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One Thousand Odd Spiders
One is encouraged not to reply to 'Charlesvdw' using the invective that might actually be relevant.
6 Aug
6:16am, 6 Aug 2024
12,741 posts
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Joopsy
IBA digs in on Olympic boxing controversy that Imane Khelif calls a ‘fierce campaign’
PARIS, FRANCE - AUGUST 03: Imane Khelif of Team Algeria looks on prior to the Women's 66kg Quarter-final round match against Anna Luca Hamori of Team Hungary on day eight of the Olympic Games Paris 2024 at North Paris Arena on August 03, 2024 in Paris, France. (Photo by Richard Pelham/Getty Images)
By Zack Pierce and Nicole Auerbach
Aug 5, 2024
PARIS — The International Boxing Association, the organization whose decision to disqualify Imane Khelif of Algeria and Lin Yu-ting of Taiwan from the 2023 world championships is at the heart of a firestorm engulfing the Olympic tournament, hosted a news conference on Monday “dedicated to the detailed explanation of the reasons for the disqualification” of the two fighters.

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Instead, what followed was a two-hour affair of little explanation, a great deal of obfuscation, and a series of evasive answers to reporters’ questions that did nothing to back up the IBA’s claims that the women should be ineligible to compete in women’s divisions, even though they were both assigned female at birth and identify on official documents as women.

The controversy escalated last week when Khelif’s round-of-16 opponent at the Olympics, Italy’s Angela Carini, quit their bout after just 46 seconds after taking hard punches from Khelif and saying she couldn’t go on.

The unusual and swift ending to such a high-profile fight called extra attention to Khelif and Lin’s disqualifications at the 2023 worlds, an event run by the IBA, an organization backed by the Russian energy giant Gazprom that has been expelled from its association with the International Olympic Committee and the Games themselves.

Khelif and Lin were disqualified in the middle of the 2023 tournament, a few days after Khelif had defeated a Russian boxer, Azaliia Amineva. The IBA said Khelif and Lin were found to have “competitive advantages over other female competitors.”

Khelif said in an interview published Monday by The Associated Press and its video partner SNTV that she feels her best response to the “fierce campaign” against her is to win a gold medal.

“This thing has effects, massive effects. It can destroy people, it can kill people’s thoughts, spirit, and mind,” she said. “And it can divide people. And because of that, I ask them to refrain from bullying.”

Play: Video
On Monday, with a platform to lay out their supposed evidence for the disqualifications, IBA president Umar Kremlev spent most of his time speaking in vague terms about upholding rules, defending democracy and dissatisfaction with IOC president Thomas Bach, while repeatedly criticizing the opening ceremony of the Paris Games.

The expert doctor the IBA brought to the panel — Dr. Ioannis Filippatos, a former chair of the IBA’s medical committee — offered little in medical specifics, saying, at one point, “I don’t want to speak too much medicine to you.”

Asked how anyone could trust the IBA after years of judging scandals, financial corruption and other misdeeds, Chris Roberts, the organization’s secretary general, talked about bureaucratic successes that had little to do with public trust.

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About the closest anyone got to adding detail was when talking about two separate blood tests they said Khelif and Lin underwent, though no documentation of the tests were provided. One test was performed in Istanbul in 2022 and deemed “inconclusive,” Roberts said. A second test was then performed at the world championships in 2023 that led to their subsequent disqualifications.

The IBA officials said the national Olympic committees of Chinese Taipei (the Olympic designation for Taiwan) told them not to disclose private information about any boxers.

Instead, the officials spoke in broad and often contradictory terms about gender, sex and their own tests. Kremlev said the testing showed testosterone levels as high as those for men but that he could not give any proof. The comment contradicted IBA’s official statement last Thursday, in which it stated that “the athletes did not undergo a testosterone examination.” But, repeatedly, IBA officials referred to high testosterone levels at Monday’s news conference.

“We’re not able to disclose the results of any tests,” Roberts said. “But you can read between the lines about where that sits.”

Kremlev said Monday that the IBA would compensate the “women victims” who lost to Khelif and Lin at the Paris Games, saying that they were harmed by the inclusion of the two fighters in the event. He did not express any concern for the mental or physical wellbeing of Khelif and Lin, who have found themselves at the center widespread scorn, though he was asked specifically about them.

Khelif’s coach, Mohamed Chaoua, in an interview with SNTV and the AP, dismissed the IBA’s tests as “worthless.” “They (boxing authorities) did some worthless tests, tests that don’t show anything, the only test that matter is the sexual one, the only test to prove a person is a man or a woman, or trans,” Chaoua said in the interview. “They didn’t (do those tests). They took blood samples and said they found this and that.”

The IOC — which has said that countries that stay loyal to the IBA are risking boxing at the 2028 Los Angeles Olympics — has repeatedly defended Khelif and Lin’s inclusion in the Games, saying they meet all eligibility criteria.

go-deeper
GO DEEPER

Questions and answers: The Olympic women’s boxing gender controversy

“They are eligible by the rules of the federation which was set in 2016, and which worked for Tokyo too,” where Khelif and Lin also competed, IOC spokesman Mark Adams said last week. “To compete as women, which is what they are. And we fully support that.”

Khelif’s quarterfinal opponent, Hungary’s Anna Luca Hamori, added fuel to the controversy before their bout with a series of disparaging social media posts that played into the IBA’s messaging. Their fight went the distance, with Khelif winning by unanimous decision. The two seemed cordial after the fight, but the Hungarian fighter’s camp did not exactly douse the fire in its post-fight comments.

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“We are not afraid of difficult circumstances and are ready to fight even among difficult circumstances,” said Balázs Fürjes, a Hungarian International Olympic Committee member. “We are proud founding members of the international Olympic family. We are 100 percent convinced that the International Olympic Committee will make the right decisions.”

After beating Hamori, Khelif collapsed to the mat in tears. She told the AP the whole ordeal was weighing on her.

“I couldn’t control my nerves,” Khelif said. “Because after the media frenzy and after the victory, there was a mix of joy and at the same time. I was greatly affected because honestly. It wasn’t an easy thing to go through at all. It was something that harms human dignity. And this is what affected me at the end of the match.”

Nearly two hours into Monday’s news conference, most of the reporters present relocated toward the back of the room, where another Algerian boxer, Roumaysa Boualam, spoke in support of Khelif, her friend. Boualam held the Algerian flag as she called the entire ordeal “disgusting.”

“She will box, and she will fight,” Boualam said. “This is unfair, what’s happened. … We have to support her.”

Khelif (66 kilograms, 125 pounds) and Lin (57 kilograms, 145 pounds) have already clinched medals by making the semifinals in their respective weight classes. Boxing has no bronze medal bout — the semifinal losers each get a bronze and are not asked to fight again.

Khelif fights Tuesday night at Roland Garros, which is converting one of its arenas to a boxing venue with tennis concluded. Lin fights Wednesday night.
6 Aug
6:18am, 6 Aug 2024
12,742 posts
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Joopsy
Taken from. the Athletic. That's cleared that up then!

Russian backed organisation can't seem to provide a clear explanation, doubt that will stop all the armchair experts though.

About This Thread

Maintained by
A thread about how we can encourage and include people in whatever exercise they are interested in and removing barriers to participation.

Glossary
--------------------
Amendments/Corrections/Requests just ask for a sidebar edit.
This is NOT comprehensive, just some helpful shorthand.
---------------------

Gender Identity ≠ Gender Expression ≠ Anatomical Sex ≠ Sexual Orientation

Anatomical sex = The physical aspects that make you fit into a category based on genitals, chromosomes etc i.e. Intersex, Female, Male...
Gender identity = The internal view of gender, the way you see yourself.
Gender expression = The way you present to others externally through clothing, behaviours, language and other social signals.

Sexual orientation = Who you are attracted to.

None of the above are dependent on any of the others, individuals may relate one to another in their specific case, but assuming what one might be based on observation of another is not a sound basis for determination.

Transgender (Trans) = When your gender identity does not match your identity assigned at birth based on anatomical sex.
Cisgender (Cis) = When your gender identity matches your identity assigned at birth based on anatomical sex.
Non Binary (Enby) = When your gender identity doesn't fall into either of the female/male choice. It may exist somewhere on the spectrum between woman and man, either stable of fluctuating between woman-ness and man-ness. This may encapsulate those that may use terms such as genderfluid, agender, demigender et al.

Pronouns = she/her, him/his, them/they etc...
How to refer best to someone else. Really simply, follow their lead. Ask if unsure, be polite. If corrected, it's not a problem unless you repeatedly ignore correction.

Transition = The process somebody goes through to alter their physical attributes to better match their gender identity and expression.

Dysphoria = The distress a person feels due to a mismatch between their gender identity and their sex assigned at birth. Can fluctuate and be experienced at varying degrees.
Dysmorphia = Discomfort with the shape/form of the body. Present in eating disorders and the like, but can often effect transgender people, with triggers such as body hair presence/absence, chest/genital presentation etc.
Deadname - The name a person is assigned at birth, that they no longer use.

Triggers = Things that are known to cause an effect. Typically, X causes a person to experience dysphoria/dysmorphia. Sometimes these can be managed/avoided, other times they are inevitable.

Acronyms:
amab = assigned male at birth (originally born anatomically male)

afab = assigned female at birth (originally born anatomically female)

ftm = female to male transitioner
mtf = male to female transitioner
egg = state of somebody before becoming aware they were transgender i.e. "their egg cracked when they realised and began to emerge"
GIC/GIS = Gender Identity Clinic/Service, providing transition services
GRS = Gender Reassignment Surgery

General notes:
* Not everyone will be comfortable talking about their situation, depending on where they are.
* Not everyone has the language to articulate how they feel, what they want to say. Be patient.
* These things are NOT static, what you encounter in a person today may evolve into something else later.
* Am I trans/cis/enby etc... Frankly, you tell us. Whatever YOU are comfortable with at the time is what we will adopt. It is YOUR identity.
* This language is weird. Yup, and we (CreatureOfTheHill) as a plural system talk strange too, it's OK. We (CreatureOfTheHill) are not "normal", never have been.
* Am I weird/abnormal? Possibly, but it has NOTHING to do with being here or being trans/enby or whatever. People just are in general, and that is OK, we love you for your quirkiness.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tFL5GTKwonQ


Resources:
Genderbread Person genderbread.org

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