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Oct 2017
1:05pm, 10 Oct 2017
13,738 posts
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Fenland (Fenners) Runner
...and you are right about Comrades, love to do it, but no chance of my permit to travel being signed. 
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Oct 2017
1:11pm, 10 Oct 2017
27,631 posts
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HappyG(rrr)
Gotta get that sub 3 out of the way first Bazo before retiring to ultras
I just looked up the Alchester runner who overtook me (think he was the only one in whole race.
Split Chip Time Pace Leg Time Pace
10K 45:50 07:22 45:50 07:22
20K 01:31:44 07:22 45:54 07:23
30K 02:17:04 07:21 45:20 07:17
40K 03:00:22 07:15 43:17 06:58
Finish 03:09:03 07:12 08:41 06:21
No wonder I couldn't keep up with him - 7:22 to half way, 6:21 finish pace! Must have been a 4 min neg split?! And 6:56 pace for last 7 miles. On that course, good going! And looking up power of 10 it's not like he was doing it as progressive training run or something - that was a new PB, down from 3:22 at London! Weird pacing. Worse than me! G
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Oct 2017
1:23pm, 10 Oct 2017
13,739 posts
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Fenland (Fenners) Runner
No only mentally but also using the theory of muscle recruitment that is an excellent way to run a marathon. Well done that person and you, HappyG.
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Oct 2017
1:34pm, 10 Oct 2017
5 posts
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pete86
Regarding pacing I'm glad I chose to go with the 3hr pacers even though I wasn't quite in shape to go sub3. The benefit of running in a group and not having to think much about pace probably outweighed the benefit of going out a few seconds per mile slower on my own to achieve a more even-paced race.
I suppose you've got to be quite close to achieving the pacing time though and in a bigger marathon it could get difficult at the water stations running in a big pacing group
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Oct 2017
1:43pm, 10 Oct 2017
3,014 posts
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larkim
The water stations were the biggest surprise to me at the weekend in my first experience of running in a pace group. Recipe for plenty of disasters there! Not sure whether the best thing to do would be run through the group and recover backwards, or drop back and pull them back in, to get some clear space to run in.
If I'd been aiming for 3:07 or 3:20 though I'd have been in pacing no-mans land and wonder how that would have felt as I definitely benefitted from the pacers.
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Oct 2017
1:43pm, 10 Oct 2017
3,211 posts
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Windsor Wool
welcome Pete, excellent time at Chester. Those hills get bigger every time someone writes about them. Soon they'll be bigger than the Altrincham Himalayas that confront you halfway round Manchester!
The guy who overtook you G, he must have felt great on the day going past everyone like that. 2 days later he'll be having the (natural) Larkim moments wondering why he didn't leave it all out there. Big waste in my opinion.
CW - parkrun 8 days out is too risky for me. No need to do that. If you don't want to do the intervals you don't have to but if you've been sticking to the plan why not? Equally, you could convert the session to something + strides or something with MP in the middle.
I am writing Steve's motto on my hand in Sharpie ahead of the Abingdon. Got to face up to and actually relish the mental battle of the last few miles. 1 day in to the taper I can't wait!!
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Oct 2017
1:51pm, 10 Oct 2017
3,015 posts
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larkim
So this reminds me - how did I do compared to your calc WW?
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Oct 2017
1:53pm, 10 Oct 2017
13,740 posts
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Fenland (Fenners) Runner
WW, you're way better and more experienced than me, but I reckon getting to the end pondering whether you COULD (!) have run faster is so much better than getting to mile 20,21,22 (or whatever) and dieing on your arse. I have been that soldier, many, many, times.
That guy, HappyG and larkim absolutely nailed it in my honest opinion.
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Oct 2017
2:02pm, 10 Oct 2017
3,212 posts
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Windsor Wool
PMSL at your opening words there Fenners - you do me on marathon experience by a factor of 10!
On outcomes, it depends if you want to have a great run or your optimal time I'd say. I've always enjoyed the races where I've started relaxed, finished strong. It is a great feeling but getting the best time outcome surely can only come on that day that you pick the right pace early and stick with it (larkim-style).
As for G, we all knew that he'd run like that, this was his comeback. Not quite at his best (yet) but had a great build-up and with the extra training in the bank from history sub 3:15 was always going to be a cruise. Faster next time for our man G, for sure.
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Oct 2017
2:04pm, 10 Oct 2017
27,632 posts
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HappyG(rrr)
Fenners, I agree with you that it's nice to finish comfortably, but I think we've established that you don't get your quickest race time doing that. Even pacing or small pos split is the way to get that. So larkim, Bazo did that right. I was prob a bit too negative and Mr Alchester was definitely WAY too negative a split to have got his best. I would say he could have got 3:05 if he ran 1:32 / 1:33. To do 1:37 / 1:32 just seems wasteful, like WW says.
However, there can be reasons - maybe he does have another marathon coming up in a month or two and wants to go sub 3 and he was treating last 7 miles at MP (6:5x, so he nailed that!) Who knows?
I've never used pacers at a marathon (I started at 3:12 and finished at 2:57:37, so other than the sub 3 guys that I could have tried at London, no pace group would have suited me.) I don't think I'd like it either. I like to start slower and gauge at all times how I feel, not be pushed to speed up or slow down. Also, that group was seriously tight. I had to overtake the 3:30 and the 3:15 and there was some risk of tripping each other, or clipping a curb or standing on a bottle. Not nice. But each to their own! G
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