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Nov 2023
4:14pm, 6 Nov 2023
10,292 posts
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Fields
And even if they charity-white-wash themselves towards the end of their careers, there are tangible "good" outcomes (e.g. Gates ref Malaria).
Jimmy Savile raised a lot of money for charity 🤷🏻‍♂️
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Nov 2023
4:26pm, 6 Nov 2023
22,539 posts
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larkim
I'm sure plenty of crooks raise money for charity. I don't think anyone pretends that that provides a ying to the yang of their evil - and in Savile's case that's exactly what it was.
Whether big money and finance and US-style entrepreneur capitalism is evil to the same degree I think there are varying opinions on. If Gordon Gecko made his millions and gave 10% to charity, that doesn't make his greed good.
But equally painting some of those high profile "leaders" in their sectors as being in the same ballpark as Savile? Not sure that flies.
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Nov 2023
4:29pm, 6 Nov 2023
14,963 posts
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Dave W
Charities that are must haves, like RNLI, Air Ambulance, Cancer Research, Samaritans etc, should not have to be charities at all. They should be funded by general taxation.
You've got MP's claiming for duck houses and second homes and heating their stables, and the RNLI has to shake a tin for coppers. What an arse about face country we live in.
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Nov 2023
4:31pm, 6 Nov 2023
22,540 posts
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larkim
That’s disappointing LindsD. larkim, I’m not remotely impressed by the charity whitewashing. Good causes should be supported (or not) based on a democratic mandate to raise taxes fairly, not on the whims of a handful of mega-wealthy tax dodgers.
So it matters not whether Gates has used the accumulated earnings of him over the years to fund malaria responses that simply weren't happening with the pace they needed without his ability to finance it?
Don't get me wrong, I'm the first person to say charity shouldn't exist because states and the international community should be the first and only port of call for pulling people out of health and economic need especially where things are at crisis point.
But I'd rather welcome the late-career philanthropy of the mega rich than sneer at it and tell them they shouldn't have bothered. I can't be the judge, of course, but what Gates in particular has done doesn't appear to me to be lacking in any generosity of humanity, and if it did only occur to him once he'd made his billions through evil, capitalist activities that he could use this for good, I'd still rather that money ended up doing good than simply being pumped back into commerce.
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Nov 2023
4:32pm, 6 Nov 2023
22,541 posts
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larkim
Charities that are must haves, like RNLI, Air Ambulance, Cancer Research, Samaritans etc, should not have to be charities at all. They should be funded by general taxation. You've got MP's claiming for duck houses and second homes and heating their stables, and the RNLI has to shake a tin for coppers. What an arse about face country we live in.
The RNLI isn't short of a bob or two (or at least it wasn't the last time I looked at their accounts when I previously worked in the charity sector). But I 100% agree - these services, amongst many others, should be funded by us through taxation.
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Nov 2023
5:32pm, 6 Nov 2023
15,807 posts
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jda
It's only a fraction of his wealth and yes I do think it's absolutely wrong that one person can wield so much wealth and power in determining which problems are addressed. It's possible that he's made unexpectedly good choices but even if he has, it's still undermining our society.
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Nov 2023
6:41pm, 6 Nov 2023
10,293 posts
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Fields
Looks like the march in London about the ongoing situation in Gaza on Saturday is going to be banned as it’s apparently inappropriate with remembrance events taking place on Sunday, even though the march route this coming weekend goes nowhere near the Cenotaph and the organisers are well aware of the sensitivities involved.
This story has been built up over the last few days by govt aligned far right media channels eg GB News / Daily Express, as well as Braverman calling them “hate marches” etc, comments about anti-British values etc, all this putting pressure on the police to ban the march.
It might be thought ironic that protests against war are banned while we commemorate those who died in war.
As a reminder it’s also apparently not the right time to protest during the coronation, queens funeral, or indeed any other time the establishment don’t want protest - which in the case of this government is every time.
As an observation, this govt and the right wing media establishment have never had an issue with the National Front / BNP marching to the cenotaph and laying wreaths.
Personally I would be more appalled at fascists being allowed to lay wreaths at the monument for those who died fighting fascism, rather than those fighting a fascist state being banned from protest.
I wonder what those with an actual forces background think?
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Nov 2023
6:59pm, 6 Nov 2023
9,735 posts
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simbil
Going back to Musk, it's always interesting what a 'marmite' reaction he gets. No doubt he has had successes, but also started with significant backing that most people don't have, and that he has halved the value of Twitter and had a few other terrible investments like Hyperloop - which in particular make you question his savvy as it is obviously a seriously flawed concept (that might at some points returned on investments due to hype without merit).
As for Tesla - check out China's innovations for mass market affordable EVs rather than status symbols with poor compatibility.
He's got some interesting ideas on AI and seems to have quite a healthy utopian attitude to technology freeing mankind from drudgery and misery. Definitely ideas I can get on board with.
So a mixed bag for sure 
Sunak on the other hand looks mediocre and uninteresting next to Musk. Maybe he was hoping some sparkle would rub off?
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Nov 2023
7:52pm, 6 Nov 2023
31,213 posts
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Johnny Blaze
“Charity is a cold grey loveless thing. If a rich man wants to help the poor, he should pay his taxes gladly, not dole out money at a whim.”
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Nov 2023
8:01pm, 6 Nov 2023
3,637 posts
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paulcook
Wonder what difference it would make to finances, management and political running of some of those charities if they did move from the third sector to the public sector.
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