Jul 2023
4:28pm, 21 Jul 2023
30,639 posts
|
Johnny Blaze
Cans of worms can come in a surprising range of sizes. That one is about the size of a four metre skip.
|
|
Jul 2023
4:31pm, 21 Jul 2023
30,640 posts
|
Johnny Blaze
“How many ancient relics will I kill if I do nothing? Bozza needs a number! Best guess will do! Fwah!”
|
Jul 2023
5:12pm, 21 Jul 2023
20,557 posts
|
Chrisull
Labour aren't being particularly moderate tho, or centrist currently. If they were, I could hold my nose. Chris Skidmore of the Tories (and remember while he might be the best of the bunch on offer, the only Tories left currently pretty much are rabid, frothing at the mouth Brexit cultists, because ALL the sensible ones got ejected at the last election) is able to attack Starmer comfortably from the left here. What is in the current Labour manifesto/policies that couldn't be offered by a more moderate, sensible Tory party? (Imagine Dominic Grieve as leader, David Gauke as chancellor, Nick Boles as home secretary and Rory Stewart as foreign secretary). Shoot. There's got to be some.... I'll start, right to roam is one. There must be more. But on Brexit, on planning, on climate, on energy, even on infrastructure/public transport - because the Tories are already having to nationalise failing rail companies, I'm not seeing it. Convince me, I'm ready to listen. |
|
Jul 2023
5:20pm, 21 Jul 2023
30,641 posts
|
Johnny Blaze
Well, I already sent you 20 detailed pages on green policy which you immediately dismissed so I think I’m looking at diminishing returns here, but I’ll throw a random one in: eliminate tax advantages for Private Schools.
|
|
Jul 2023
5:27pm, 21 Jul 2023
30,642 posts
|
Johnny Blaze
labour.org.uk
|
|
Jul 2023
7:37pm, 21 Jul 2023
20,558 posts
|
Chrisull
Yeah I'll take that. The thing was I was being MORE specific. I was saying specifically in the manifesto, what might a moderate Tory party never countenance, which is quite different to what things are there in the Labour party manifesto I like. There's almost an implication here that it's impossible to like anything in the Tory manifesto here which I'm not comfortable with, no party has a monopoly on good ideas. The universal basic income comes somewhat from the right. Anyway my problem is with Starmer is an obvious example in 2015 was Labour raising the minimum wage to £8/8.50 (can't remember which), which Osborne completely ate their lunch by raising it to £9. That specifically WOULD NOT have happened under Blair/Brown, no way would the Tories have introduced a minimum wage. However that state of affairs definitely exists under Starmer, plenty of ideas (such as GB energy firm) that I'm not sure why the Tories aren't doing it (probably because it isn't culture war bullshit enough for them. I've a feeling we're just going round in circles here, I appreciate, you have similar views on what a transformative govt might look like to me (PR, fairer taxation, radical reform of House of Lords etc etc), just that you seem to think that Starmer still offers that possibility, and at the moment I don't think so, and I don't think either of us are going to move significantly from that. And I'll leave it to Matt Chorley of the Times who said it absolutely perfectly today here (if somewhat facetiously): "What is the point of a Labour Party, some might ask, if they are going to do everything the Tories have been doing, just with a sad face" twitter.com |
Jul 2023
7:50pm, 21 Jul 2023
72 posts
|
5km_is_plenty
The point of the Labour party under Starmer is that they are not the horrid, corrupt, self serving Tories that are currently in power.
|
Jul 2023
8:03pm, 21 Jul 2023
17,784 posts
|
JK *chameleon*
Way I see it, if Labour win the next General election, they're likely to be one and done, followed by another 10/15 years of Tory, as they'll be blamed by the RW press for all the things caused by the current lot, which the noddies will lap up. If Labour don't win (note: not the same as Tories winning), then perhaps the election after isn't a guaranteed Tory win. Is there an argument for short term pain for longer term gain? I have no way of influencing this of course, so just musing. |
Jul 2023
8:57pm, 21 Jul 2023
2,740 posts
|
Surelynot
Labour's National Policy Forum is meeting this weekend. I am a fair person so will wait to see the output from that before making further comment on Labour policy.
|
Jul 2023
9:02pm, 21 Jul 2023
41,840 posts
|
SPR
Keir Starmer: Ulez expansion needed to curb lung cancer standard.co.uk This is the problem. |
Useful Links
FE accepts no responsibility for external links. Or anything, really.Related Threads
-
Fantasy General Election
Jul 2024
-
EU Referendum - In or Out? Vote here
Aug 2018
-
March to Parliament Against Brexit - Sat 2nd July
Jun 2016
-
EU Referendum
Feb 2016
-
Ads on Fetch - anyone else getting Leave and Remain?!
Feb 2017
-
The Environment Thread :-)
Oct 2024
-
Economics
Aug 2023
-
Dear Scottish Fetchies
Jan 2023
-
Any economists out there - question
Oct 2022
-
Power and exploitation - please check my sanity
Oct 2018
