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HappyG(rrr) Sep 2021 2:22pm, 16 Sep 2021 39,718 posts	Quote Pin HappyG(rrr) Or was it a foot bone? Anyway, a better study here arguing the opposite - that we may have evolved running / persistence hunting in order to hunt down more energy rich prey in order to feed the growing human brain. researchmatters.in G
HappyG(rrr) Sep 2021 2:22pm, 16 Sep 2021 39,719 posts	Quote Pin HappyG(rrr) (The word "brain" is in my post so it's allowed, right?!)
DrPhleecingD Sep 2021 2:27pm, 16 Sep 2021 53,165 posts	Quote Pin DrPhleecingD Yes he discussed that too in the podcast, he even talked about doing the Man versus Horse race as an example. I suppose the evolutionary argument is that we didn’t evolve to inherently enjoy exercise as an activity in its own right. Though all the research shows that if you ask people walk for 10 minutes then they report feeling better and afterwards. So how does that fit in? I’d actually like to do a study on whether exercise with a purpose is more enjoyable than pointless exercise. The current research on that is kind of muddied by environmental factors.
HappyG(rrr) Sep 2021 2:36pm, 16 Sep 2021 39,721 posts	Quote Pin HappyG(rrr) I always (perhaps very simplistically - not a scientist!) assumed it went: - driver: need to put in physical effort to hunt (to eat, to survive), so evolve to "like" that (endorphins or other positive feedback) - control: risk of damage or death - negative feedback: pain, lactic acid etc. - driver removed: satiated - if you've eaten, you don't need to run. Have sex instead. (Mazlow's hierarchy of needs) Modern world: can eat by buying stuff. No need to exercise. Have fun instead - sex, tv etc. So unless you "give yourself" a driver (not suggesting you starve yourself, and then go out with your mates to Richmond Park in a pack to tire out some of the deer and bag them with a spear) - e.g. artificial goal in order to then receive the physical positive feedback (endorphins). But that's a physiological model. I'm sure purely psychological (pride, goal setting and achievement, boasting, competition etc.) or mixed models could be proposed too. G
Canute Sep 2021 4:27pm, 16 Sep 2021 2,431 posts	Quote Pin Canute I agree with Fleecy that we are hard wired to avoid unnecessary exertion. It is plausible that when food was at a premium we needed to maximize efficiency when engaging in exertion. We needed to retain some energy in reserve at all time in case we encountered a predator. However, we also needed to be successful hunters or gatherers ourselves. Just as we evolved to enjoy sex, we almost certainly evolved mechanisms to make some forms of exercise enjoyable. Release of dopamine and endorphins are probably examples of such mechanisms. I suspect that we also evolved the ability to tune into the state of our body, but that ability has atrophied. The question of whether we evolved to enjoy walking more than running is an interesting debate (touched on in the interesting blog linked by HappyG). Whatever form of exercise takes your fancy, I suspect that you can develop the ability to tune into the enjoyable aspects. The techniques of Rational Emotive Therapy described in the link by Pix is one way to do it.
DrPhleecingD Sep 2021 6:41pm, 16 Sep 2021 53,166 posts	Quote Pin DrPhleecingD HappyGrr, I agree that goal setting and feelings of achievement etc are probably key to feeling good about running, or at least being able to push through the unpleasant feelings sometimes experienced when running fast. Though the famous runner’s high only happens (for some) after about 30 minutes plus of higher intensity exercise. There’s no walker’s high…
Sharkie Sep 2021 6:46pm, 16 Sep 2021 18,621 posts	Quote Pin Sharkie I really enjoy nearly all the exercise I do even though some it is (briefly) unpleasant. It's key that I like learning difficult - or at least complicated movement patterns and a sense of mastery is quite important to me.
Sharkie Sep 2021 6:47pm, 16 Sep 2021 18,622 posts	Quote Pin Sharkie Enjoying the process is REALLY important.
Little Miss Happy Sep 2021 7:00pm, 16 Sep 2021 4,957 posts	Quote Pin Little Miss Happy Definitely. I don’t think it’s sustainable if you’re just result focused.
Canute Sep 2021 7:50pm, 16 Sep 2021 2,432 posts	Quote Pin Canute When was a youngster I ran because it was fun. At age 5 I preferred to run to school rather than walk. Nowadays, when I watch lambs gambolling, I am reminded of the sheer joy of running for its own sake. Twenty years later, I enjoyed the sensation of running fairly fast, especially across rough terrain. Leaping from rock to rock was a special delight. Twice in my life I have experienced that amazing feeling of being in the zone, where running is effortless, during a race. In those two races I set by lifetime PB for 5000m and 10,000m. Seventy years later, I am much less agile and have much less power in my legs, but I still enjoy jogging to the shop. I also enjoy running down hill on grassy hillsides, but I am much less sure-footed on rocky terrain. However, I do not think I have ever had the experience that people describe as the runner’s high.