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Oct 2023
5:17pm, 27 Oct 2023
101,412 posts
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swittle
One blond has-been for another...
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Oct 2023
5:18pm, 27 Oct 2023
31,168 posts
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Johnny Blaze
In his departure speech, Boris Johnson likened himself to Cincinnatus, a figure who “returned to his plough”, apparently suggesting he would return quietly to the backbenches...
Et voila. I knew I read it somewhere...
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Oct 2023
5:26pm, 27 Oct 2023
3,579 posts
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paulcook
“Quietly”?!
Haha.
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Oct 2023
5:31pm, 27 Oct 2023
21,008 posts
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rf_fozzy
Happy. To me, this is no different to the "Corbyn did nothing wrong" brigade - you want the SNP to succeed so you can't see how bad it looks.
The amounts, whether or not it was technically legal or not. None of that matters. It **looks** bad and smells bad.
Something doesn't have to be illegal to be wrong.
And what's more sturgeon knew it because she resigned before she got the boot. She knew it would be seen for what it is.
Again, if this were the Tories, you'd be up in arms.
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Oct 2023
5:41pm, 27 Oct 2023
2,920 posts
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Surelynot
I think it's you who is blinkered on this case, Fozzy. I'm not being clever. I'm responding to your statement as 'fact', something that is yet to be established.
So you're now saying she's 'politically' guilty? I don't understand what that means. Really.
Incidentally, the 'moments before she was questioned under caution' was a period of four months. The investigation has been going on since July 2021. Not a single person has been charged.
You are also ignoring other political factors at play, such as gender recognition and the stalling of the independence drive under her leadership, which are likely factors in her decision to step down.
As for accusations against Boris Johnson or any other human being, I would be careful about starting it a 'fact' that someone has done something wrong while there is an ongoing investigation. I may comment and express an opinion, but I'd never be so confident to state something as a 'fact'.
I can guarantee you I will not defend anyone found guilty of embezzlement of political funds, regardless of the party. I will condemn Sturgeon should she be found guilty of wrongdoing. I just don't have the arrogance to assume guilt while investigations are ongoing.
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Oct 2023
6:00pm, 27 Oct 2023
15,720 posts
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jda
Fozzy has made it very clear that’s he’s not bothered about facts or truth, it’s just whether it “looks bad” or not. It seems to me this is often a question of how the press chooses to present something. I don’t think it’s a good approach.
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Oct 2023
6:18pm, 27 Oct 2023
2,921 posts
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Surelynot
I respect anyone's right to an opinion. I wouldn't expect that opinion to be elevated to the status of 'fact'.
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Oct 2023
7:22pm, 27 Oct 2023
25,809 posts
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Bazoaxe
There are three known facts:
1) £600k+ was raised to be ringfenced for use in IndyRef 2
2) The money is not ringfenced and has been spent
3) There has not been an IndyRef 2
Is this a criminal offence ? We dont yet know. I dont believe it is.
Is it transparent and honest? well you can argue thats my opinion, but I think that is a 4th fact.
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Oct 2023
7:23pm, 27 Oct 2023
21,009 posts
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rf_fozzy
If you want to be blinkered to the cult of personality because she's the standard bearer for your pet cause so be it.
I've never claimed "facts" - I said it looks like embezzlement and it looks v dodgy.
You want innocent until proven guilty. That's a criminal interpretation, not a political one.
And it's my poltical *opinion* (as I've always claimed - not fact) that it looks v dodgy for sturgeon and her husband.
And that hasn't changed my opinion on the independence question one bit - I would still prefer Scotland to remain in the UK, but if there is a clear majority in the polls, then it's quite right there is the option of another vote. But if there is to be one, it needs better evidence and independent assessment (from the likes of the IFS) and less vitriol and bullying (like is now being thrown at me for daring to have an opinion) than demonstrated in 2014 and 2016.
And just to correct the record, sturgeon resigned on 15th Feb 2023 (but carried on as FM until a new leader was elected). Her house was searched on 5th April and Murrell was arrested - that's not 4 months. Yes, it's true that she herself was not questioned under caution until July, bu it's the April event I was referring to. So yes it was a matter of weeks.
In January, a few weeks before she had said about carrying on until the next GE, so it's clear that she jumped once it was obvious all this was going to come out.
This is of course my opinion only and I have no evidence to back this up.
But to me it looks dodgy.
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Oct 2023
7:30pm, 27 Oct 2023
4,107 posts
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Cheg
Save your characters on this one Surelynot, you’re correct.
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Fantasy General Election
Jul 2024
