So who won the tour from 1999 to 2005

80 watchers
Aug 2012
12:16pm, 24 Aug 2012
1,474 posts
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P.E...
Could be wrong I thought that the results of the LNDD test and an analysis of these results was brought up in the SCA thing? Still doesn't mean he didn't pass the tests at the time which wasn't really my point
Aug 2012
12:18pm, 24 Aug 2012
1,475 posts
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P.E...
And by that I mean I reckon they could claim it was tampered with for example. Or not stored correctly.....

Right I need my dinner it's been a bad day (nothing to do with this!)
Aug 2012
12:22pm, 24 Aug 2012
1,291 posts
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auburnette
Maybe, I think there were a lot of problems with the evidence there. Better to start from a completely clean slate. Fair enough that he may well have passed the tests at the time, but then I guess one of the reasons samples are stored is so they can be retested once the detection technology has improved.

It's worrying if he's still being pursued by the USADA in breach of their own statute of limitations, though.
an!
Aug 2012
12:37pm, 24 Aug 2012
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an!
As The Teaboy says this isn't just about take banned substances. The charges also include: "Possession of prohibited substances; trafficking of prohibited substances; administration and/or attempted administration of prohibited substances; assisting, encouraging, aiding, abetting, covering-up and other complicity involving anti-doping rule violations; and aggravating circumstances justifying a period of ineligibility greater than the standard sanction." (see e.g. http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/report-usada-has-38-armstrong-blood-samples-from-2008-to-2012).

Exactly what evidence USADA has isn't (yet) publicly available, however it's extremely unlikely that they would bring that list of charges based solely on evidence from former team-mates and other staff. Rumour has it that analysis of blood samples is part of the case (http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/report-usada-has-38-armstrong-blood-samples-from-2008-to-2012).

fraudbytes.blogspot.co.uk attempts to debunk the "why is it so bad if they were all doing it" argument.

Regarding the 'never tested positive' argument there's a long list of cyclists (Jan Ullrich, Ivan Basso and David Millar are just 3 of the more famous names) and other athletes (e.g. Marion Jones, Tim Montgomery) who have been found guilty of doping, despite never having tested positive.
may
Aug 2012
12:38pm, 24 Aug 2012
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may
Who gives a hoot !!! It's not about the bike!!!: )
Aug 2012
1:26pm, 24 Aug 2012
4,960 posts
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Chrisull
Slightly off on a tangent here is the list of 2nd places to Lance. I'm struggling to find a clean name amongst them... so I added the 3rd, adn it doesn't get much better!

1999 - 2nd Alex Zulle 3rd Fernando Escartin
2000 - 2nd Jan Ullrich 3rd Joseba Beloki
2001 - 2nd Jan Ullrich 3rd Joseba Beloki
2002 - 2nd Joseba Beloki 3rd Raimondas Rumsas
2003 - 2nd Jan Ullrich 3rd Alexandre Vinokourov
2004 - 2nd Andreas Kloden 3rd Ivan Basso
2005 - 2nd Ivan Basso 3rd Jan Ullrich

2006 - here is the list of cyclists kicked out the day before the tour started for failing doping tests: Jan Ullrich, Ivan Basso, Oscar Sevilla, Joseba Beloki, Francisco Mancebo.

Who won that year? Floyd Landis.... erk.
SPR
Aug 2012
1:29pm, 24 Aug 2012
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SPR
Chris - They weren't kicked for failing dope tests, they were implictated in Operation Puerto.
SPR
Aug 2012
1:32pm, 24 Aug 2012
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SPR
BTW Vaughters made a point in an article, that even if everyone dopes, doping can change te playing field as not everyone responds the same way to doping. So the winner with everyone doping is not always the same as the winner if no one doped. Then you have those that are willing to take bigger risks to make bigger gains.
SPR
Aug 2012
1:41pm, 24 Aug 2012
17,421 posts
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SPR
Maybe Christophe Bassons can have a couple of the titles: en.wikipedia.org
Aug 2012
1:51pm, 24 Aug 2012
4,961 posts
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Chrisull
Armstrong's comments to Bassons are still very ugly, and can't really be defended.

About This Thread

Maintained by fitzer
Given that Lance's wins now don't count.

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