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Oct 2009
10:58am, 10 Oct 2009
13,368 posts
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Dave A
I suffered in my 1st marathon with going out too hard. It didn't help that all my training runs were run hard, including the long ones. And on the longs I really felt it hard at the end. My 1st marathon had splits of 1:29 and 1:45. I really felt the last 6 miles.
My 2nd marathon I paced a lot better, as I did with all my training, and probably undercooked it a little. But that will come with practice.
Training for my 2nd marathon I was running about 120 more miles per month thn I jad been for the 1st one.
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Oct 2009
2:45pm, 10 Oct 2009
595 posts
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chirunner
"You are eventually trying to reach a state (some weeks or months down the line) in which you can run 10 miles at HRmarathon with no rise in HR and finish confident that you could go round again at the same pace with no rise in HR or loss in pace at constant HR."
Despite blackpool being my first mara my source of confidence for 3.30target was down to the fact that each time I ran 10 miles at c.8min/mile pace my HR was rock steady. For my next run this year all (ha ha) I have to do is repeat the challenge but run at 7.30 pace instead. it removes from me the whole uncertainty over whether you should be running x numbers of miles/week, y numbers of intervals and what sorts of paces to do everything at. Yes it does seem like a formula but it looks like it does work...
davea does this rule apply for you when you look back on the 1st vs 2nd mara in terms of training levels vs actual performance?
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Oct 2009
2:50pm, 10 Oct 2009
1,221 posts
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Tinytia
For those that have been training like this, forgive my understanding, do you struggle with leg turnover/speed for races where you've not been training at that speed due to the amount of slower running? Or have I missed something?
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Oct 2009
2:52pm, 10 Oct 2009
1,222 posts
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Tinytia
I ask this because when mara training, lots of longer runs, I don't produce the pb's after the mara on shorter races that I feel I 'should' be able to. I have put it down to not being 'short race sharp' having not run at 10k pace etc regularly while mara training.
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Oct 2009
2:57pm, 10 Oct 2009
4,650 posts
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Fenland Runner
I know it appears very dull but it is down to specificity and periodisation in my opinion.
Yes, some will PB at shorter distances following marathon training but would they have PBd by even more if the training had been specific to the event.
As I said a dull view.
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Oct 2009
3:02pm, 10 Oct 2009
10,385 posts
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eL Bee!
Tinytia - there is, without doubt a law of diminishing return at shorter races, but sharpening up leg speed and the like takes a very short time.
That said, all my pb's have come from training for volume and not for speed. It *could* be argued that I trained for speed a little, as there were key sessions that I added in that did involve speed, but nothing particularly complex!
But compared to some, I'm also a bit of a carthorse!! :):)
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Oct 2009
3:02pm, 10 Oct 2009
1,223 posts
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Tinytia
Indeed FR, that is the question....who knows what works for them at that time and how would things have 'played out' if it had been done differently? 
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Oct 2009
3:04pm, 10 Oct 2009
1,224 posts
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Tinytia
Funny this running lark , so much to learn about yourself and what works for YOU
el-bee- I don't think I would ever had viewed you as a carthorse!!
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Oct 2009
3:12pm, 10 Oct 2009
4,652 posts
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Fenland Runner
I percieve that in some respect it is like building a house. The slower, volume stuff can act as constructing very solid foundations. Overlay the solid foundations with specific training for the event and that should result in success.
Finally progress should be measured in years not a season.
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Oct 2009
3:14pm, 10 Oct 2009
10,390 posts
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eL Bee!
FR - indeed - but you need to keep that foundation in good shape! So even with race specific conditioning, the mileage base still needs maintaining!!
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