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Dec 2020
4:13pm, 2 Dec 2020
362 posts
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Big_G
(there's some waffle at the start, with the review starting at 1:45).
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Dec 2020
4:16pm, 2 Dec 2020
4,911 posts
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Windsor Wool
I haven't watched that yet BG, I will. I did see somewhere that someone had sent their battered VF to be re-soled with XC studs on them. I need to dig that out as that could be a nice combination!
On the subject of the shoes defending your legs in the marathon, I hadn't linked it all together until now but I went back and looked at the last 3 marathons I've run and in each one I wrote that it wasn't my legs that broke today, the engine ran out of gas. Prior to that the legs had always gone, mainly cramp....
The other thing I have experienced with the VF and the next% is that my feet are significantly less beaten up at the end of a marathon. In the past my feet would be a complete mess, that's no longer the issue.
I say no longer, in current state of fitness I don't think I'd get past halfway!
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Dec 2020
4:27pm, 2 Dec 2020
363 posts
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Big_G
Interesting, thanks WW.
I suppose I should say, in case anyone isn't aware, Seth is usually quite positive and I think tries to find good things to say about stuff in general.
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Dec 2020
4:35pm, 2 Dec 2020
4,204 posts
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K5 Gus
I've often wondered why Nike haven't done a ZoomX plated race trail shoe.
1. Lower the stack height a few mm by reducing the thickness of ZoomX, you're not pounding on tarmac for 26 miles.
2. Broaden and flare out the midsole and sole to increase the stability ( the 4% is far too skinny at the heel for trail running )
3. Trail shoes often have some sort of rockplate in them to protect the feet, so the carbon plate performs that role as well as it's stability role.
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Dec 2020
4:39pm, 2 Dec 2020
8,912 posts
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jda
Isn’t the foam far too vulnerable? My trail shoes are all far removed from road shoes.
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Dec 2020
4:45pm, 2 Dec 2020
12,850 posts
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❄larkim❄
I'd be sceptical that there is any measurable gain for trail shoes given the inconsistency in each stride. And it's probably not worth the R&D monies to fund the "science" given nature of trail racing.
That said, there should be scope for faster trail shoes; I'm just not sure Nike is that heavily invested in that section of the market, and innovations from the stalwarts in that area tend to focus on weight and grip, leaving comfort and speed to be taken care of via the terrain and / or the runner.
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Dec 2020
4:54pm, 2 Dec 2020
4,205 posts
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K5 Gus
The measurable gain would be weight as ZoomX is lighter than EVA, and as I said the carbon plate would be instead of a nylon rockplate.
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Dec 2020
4:57pm, 2 Dec 2020
364 posts
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Big_G
It was funny as there was a live stream of Pikes Peak Marathon in Colorado a few months ago. It's a very tough, trail event with a lot of vertical gain at altitude (I think it tops out at 14000ft), switch backs and some very technical bits, and the live stream at the summit showed a guy up there in a pair of Nike Vaporflys. How he got up (and hopefully down!) in those I don't know!
I suppose there are different types of "trails" though - from a nice, easy trail, to very tough technical trails. For racing, if it's decent trails and not too technical there may be some benefit for a racing trail shoe I suppose? But for tough fell races, or very technical trails where a lot of walking and/or scrambling may be needed, I can't see how it could be that useful. Seth's main complaint was the weight of the shoe he tried, so maybe if they strip it right back for racing, it could be something for some types of trail?
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Dec 2020
5:06pm, 2 Dec 2020
3,276 posts
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J2R
I have a pair of Hoka Mafate trail shoes which are pretty thick and clumpy, and probably the heaviest shoes I currently own. The maximalist approach to trail shoes is nothing new - although something like the Alphafly shoes would make my Hokas seem like barefoot running, I suppose.
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Dec 2020
7:01pm, 2 Dec 2020
3,277 posts
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J2R
The reason I asked about the Asics MetaRacer and the New Balance shoes were that from the reviews I've read, these seem a little more angled at shorter distances, 5K to HM, although both can be used for the marathon by runners who don't need quite the cushioning.
The Nikes and the Saucony Endorphin Pros are spoken of as being primarily shoes for HM and marathon distances, and not especially suited to shorter distances. Given that I am aiming mainly at 5K to HM distance myself, with no immediate marathon plans, I am wondering if these other shoes might be better for me.
Or, another related question....Have those of you who have the Nikes found that they have helped your times in e.g. 5K and 10K races, or is it only in HM distance and above?
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Nike Pegasus
Jul 2024
