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Elite Athletics Thread

6 lurkers | 167 watchers
fuzzyduck79
fuzzyduck79
Oct 2022
1:04pm, 10 Oct 2022
1,359 posts
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fuzzyduck79
Well rugby is mainly played by private schools, though I did have a mate who was head of rugby at Wycombe RGS (they fielded about 18 teams!) so it’s a bit niche still and when I say rampant I mean among those who have a sniff of making regional squads, I suspect it takes off around 15-16 years old

Cycling spent about two decades in a state of everyone cheating, and journalists raised the alarm but it was never a scandal that everyone paid attention to until Lance confessed. Even with grand tour winners being thrown out for doping, most fans I knew seemed a bit hard to reason with. Certainly people I thought of as pretty intelligent seemed unable to hold for a moment the idea that Lance had been at it for years.

So the idea that you could blow the whistle on doping in rugby and the world would stop and pay attention? Well I don’t buy it, if people aren’t ready to hear something then it doesn’t matter how clearly you spell it all out for them, they won’t have it.

(Mo Farah having highly suspicious links to Jama Aden and the coach that turned him into a world beater now being thrown out of the sport being an example…not saying it’s 100% certain he cheated, but the arguments that he is clean are barely above the level of “Nah I don’t think he would do that”)
Fields
Fields
Oct 2022
1:11pm, 10 Oct 2022
6,859 posts
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Fields
PED is quite a big thing in rugby, which is not exclusively a private school sport, say that in some parts of the country and you’d be laughed out of town.

Certainly in SA for schoolboys who hope to make an impression at Craven week (sort of like the NFL draft), and more locally in Wales, where in some depressed areas a pro rugby contract will lift you and your family out of poverty (and so even the chance of making it into an academy / semi pro contract is very appealing as it gets you to the level beneath pro contracts) there have IIRC been cases of PED usage in the 15-18 year old age group
larkim
larkim
Oct 2022
1:14pm, 10 Oct 2022
19,231 posts
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larkim
I think rugby would be treated differently in the UK press especially because of the youngsters playing it, but I do understand the scepticism. And whilst I'll still err significantly on the side of Mo being clean, I'm not so daft or loyal to him as a fan that I can deny the hints that I'd prefer weren't there.

I've also got a 14yo who plays rugby :-) though not to regional squad standard by a long way.

The thing with doping young players in a team sport like rugby though is that if that is the case then it has to be at a level which is pretty visible; bythe accounts I've read the doping issues in cycling didn't really kick in until cyclists headed over to the continent as 18yo+ (thinking about the rife doping in the 60s and 70s here which have been well written about) and then out of sight of parents / families etc. It wouldn't take many parents of teenagers with rugby potential to take offence at being asked by club coaches etc to start supplementing with PED or PED-associated products for it to become a well evidenced practice; especially if, as you say lots of those would be pretty well off / well educated parents sending their kids to expensive private schools.

Happy to be proven wrong of course; my reptuation as an apologist for doping will no doubt precede me though!
larkim
larkim
Oct 2022
1:20pm, 10 Oct 2022
19,232 posts
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larkim
Good article on issues in S Wales though contradicting plenty of what I assume...

walesonline.co.uk
Fields
Fields
Oct 2022
1:36pm, 10 Oct 2022
6,860 posts
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Fields
Good article that.
fuzzyduck79
fuzzyduck79
Oct 2022
1:44pm, 10 Oct 2022
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fuzzyduck79
Yes very good article. And I don't get the sense that those in the sport really want things to change, so they won't. It's just a problem swept under the rug, seen as too hard to fix. Same has been seen in many other sports over the years.

Others start cheating, nobody does much to enforce the rules, so everyone else soon realises that you will only stay competitive if you also start cheating. Then everyone afterwards says they just the same as the rest, to make it a level playing field.

There were some monstrous performances at the Ironman world champs over the weekend. Conditions were quite conducive to good times but there are many who think IM as a sport is riddled with dopers (there are some who have been caught and served bans) and it's thought by many that even the age groupers are doing it at the top level. It's certainly accepted that there's not been enough testing in and out of competition to catch more than the tiniest number of those who are cheating.
fuzzyduck79
fuzzyduck79
Oct 2022
1:49pm, 10 Oct 2022
1,361 posts
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fuzzyduck79
Fwiw I lean slightly away from thinking the top pros are doping in IM. There's just something in my brain that instinctively rejects the idea that Blummenfelt or Iden are at it, but I can't rationally explain why.

But I find it pretty easy to think a rich dude who wants to go to Kona and has spent $20k on all the equipment/race fees/travel etc for their qualifier could very well have the sort of mindset that is able to justify to themselves that they should use illegal means to increase their chances of making it to the World Champs. Because after all, isn't everyone in their category doing it too? they likely tell themselves.
larkim
larkim
Oct 2022
2:14pm, 10 Oct 2022
19,234 posts
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larkim
I can see that "rich dude" scenario, definitely. In reality if I was concerned about pace it would make perfect sense for me to dope as there is absolutely zero chance of me being caught as even if I got 10 minutes faster at a marathon I'd still not be an age group winner etc.
SPR
SPR
Oct 2022
2:43pm, 10 Oct 2022
38,485 posts
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SPR
Well apart from health and moral compass reasons...
larkim
larkim
Oct 2022
2:44pm, 10 Oct 2022
19,235 posts
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larkim
Goes without saying!

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